American citizen murdered in La Victoria

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gringito
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American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby gringito » Mon Sep 02, 2013 2:35 pm

This morning, the American citizen “Christopher W.”, 35, was assassinated and robbed near his house in La Victoria, when he returned from an early shopping nearby. The assault happened in the Parque de la Urbanisazion Sta. Catalina in La Victoria, near his house, where he was intercepted by two subjects. He was shot in the arm and the thorax and deceased in the hospital.

Sources:
Peruvian press, for example:
http://elcomercio.pe/actualidad/1625747 ... a-victoria


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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby KenBE » Mon Sep 02, 2013 2:43 pm

Sad and scary. He probably resisted when the choros asked for his money. Crime is becoming a very, very big problem in Peru.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby caliguy » Mon Sep 02, 2013 3:19 pm

the poor chap was hauled away in the back of pickup truck like livestock. such is life in Lima 13 :(
every place has it's own spirit. you just need to tune into it.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby MarcoPE » Mon Sep 02, 2013 3:26 pm

caliguy wrote:the poor chap was hauled away in the back of pickup truck like livestock. such is life in Lima 13 :(


I always tell my wife that "I don't want to die here in Peru" because, basically, you are thrown into the back of a Serenazago truck and covered in whatever blanket happens to be around ... Winnie the Pooh, My Little Pony, etc...
Last edited by MarcoPE on Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Philipc4u59 » Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:03 pm

Very little respect for the victim or the family; this needs to change...

Philip :roll:
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby gringito » Mon Sep 02, 2013 6:36 pm

Philipc4u59 wrote:Very little respect for the victim or the family; this needs to change...

Philip :roll:

Who precisely showed lack of respect for the victim or his family, Phil?!
NATURALLY, my sympathy goes to the bereaved!

However, what needs to change is the increasing criminality here in Lima (and Peru)…and authorities that do not care …or even protect or support the offenders!
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby chi chi » Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:13 am

gringito wrote:However, what needs to change is the increasing criminality here in Lima (and Peru)…and authorities that do not care …or even protect or support the offenders!


Crime must be avoided before it happens.

Tarapoto is very safe but as the city grows quickly crime might enter too like in all big cities. So, to back up the police (who are allready doing a great job in Tarapoto), Serenazgo has been introduced. The patrol the streets 24 hours a day.
Begging, streetprostitution and touting is no longer allowed. Littering is taken very seriously as well.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby chi chi » Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:22 am

KenBE wrote:Sad and scary. He probably resisted when the choros asked for his money. Crime is becoming a very, very big problem in Peru.


Crime is everywhere on the rise. Especially in Europe. The economic crisis makes many so desperate that they resort to crime to survive.

Sadly, that this happened in La Victoria. Most people in La Victoria are nice and hardworking people. The people there do so much their best to make their district a better place to live. I think that those criminals came from outside La Victoria. You don't go robbing and killing someone in your own neighboorhood where people might recognise you.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby KenBE » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:50 am

chi chi wrote:
KenBE wrote:Sad and scary. He probably resisted when the choros asked for his money. Crime is becoming a very, very big problem in Peru.


Crime is everywhere on the rise. Especially in Europe. The economic crisis makes many so desperate that they resort to crime to survive.

Sadly, that this happened in La Victoria. Most people in La Victoria are nice and hardworking people. The people there do so much their best to make their district a better place to live. I think that those criminals came from outside La Victoria. You don't go robbing and killing someone in your own neighboorhood where people might recognise you.

Sorry chi chi, but crime in Europe is NOTHING compared to Peru. Sure, there is crime here in Belgium too, just like everywhere else, but it isn't epidemic like in Peru (and other Latin American countries). When I walk the streets here I don't even think about crime. In Peru you HAVE to think about it or you will become a victim at some point. Crime in Peru is one of the biggest problems the country has in my opinion.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby chi chi » Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:26 pm

KenBE wrote:Sorry chi chi, but crime in Europe is NOTHING compared to Peru. Sure, there is crime here in Belgium too, just like everywhere else, but it isn't epidemic like in Peru (and other Latin American countries). When I walk the streets here I don't even think about crime. In Peru you HAVE to think about it or you will become a victim at some point. Crime in Peru is one of the biggest problems the country has in my opinion.


Crime in Peru? You mean crime in Lima. The provinces are much safer than Lima.
Crime is the last thing people worry about in Tarapoto.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Sergio Bernales » Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:54 pm

chi chi wrote:
KenBE wrote:Sad and scary. He probably resisted when the choros asked for his money. Crime is becoming a very, very big problem in Peru.


Crime is everywhere on the rise. Especially in Europe. The economic crisis makes many so desperate that they resort to crime to survive.

Sadly, that this happened in La Victoria. Most people in La Victoria are nice and hardworking people. The people there do so much their best to make their district a better place to live. I think that those criminals came from outside La Victoria. You don't go robbing and killing someone in your own neighboorhood where people might recognise you.


Actually, Chi Chi, crime is falling in most developed countries, especially in Northern Europe, due to a mix of demographics, better policing, better security on cars and homes and other factors. Although you might expect the economic crisis to have caused an increase in crime, in general this hasn't happened in most countries.

http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/2 ... ention-not

Crime in Peru is not Lima bad, the rest of Peru safe. It goes district by district in Lima and outside, Lima, it depends which province or district you're in. For example, large parts of Trujillo are not safe. Travelling by bus, especially at night in the provinces is still very unsafe. Parts of Arequipa are unsafe and I wouldn't care to walk around somewhere like Tumbes late at night. Cusco also has a lot of crime and not just the city, but the whole province, so it's not a tourist related problem. Large parts of the jungle are also dangerous because of coca growing and drug cartels.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby KenBE » Tue Sep 03, 2013 2:05 pm

chi chi wrote:
KenBE wrote:Sorry chi chi, but crime in Europe is NOTHING compared to Peru. Sure, there is crime here in Belgium too, just like everywhere else, but it isn't epidemic like in Peru (and other Latin American countries). When I walk the streets here I don't even think about crime. In Peru you HAVE to think about it or you will become a victim at some point. Crime in Peru is one of the biggest problems the country has in my opinion.


Crime in Peru? You mean crime in Lima. The provinces are much safer than Lima.
Crime is the last thing people worry about in Tarapoto.

I am talking about crime in all Peruvian cities, not just Lima. I used to live in Trujillo, which is just as bad if not worse than Lima. I also spent 2 years in Chimbote, which is a small city and it is even worse than Trujillo as far as crime is concerned. Maybe Tarapoto is a lot safer, I don't know. I'm sure there are relatively low crime areas in Peru, like small villages in la Sierra, but the cities all have huge crime problems.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby chi chi » Tue Sep 03, 2013 2:33 pm

KenBE wrote:I am talking about crime in all Peruvian cities, not just Lima. I used to live in Trujillo, which is just as bad if not worse than Lima. I also spent 2 years in Chimbote, which is a small city and it is even worse than Trujillo as far as crime is concerned. Maybe Tarapoto is a lot safer, I don't know. I'm sure there are relatively low crime areas in Peru, like small villages in la Sierra, but the cities all have huge crime problems.


Sounds like the problem cities are located at the coast.
I don't understand why cities like Lima and Trujillo can have the same policy towards crime than Tarapoto and other cities in La Selva.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby gringito » Tue Sep 03, 2013 4:19 pm

chi chi wrote:Crime in Peru? You mean crime in Lima. The provinces are much safer than Lima.

No, I mean crime in PERU!
Though the crime rate is lower in the provincias it is a dangerous sophism to assert that the provincias were less dangerous. There is still enough crime in the provincia to spend some thoughts on your personal safety strategy. Denial or ebellishment should not be part of it.


PS:
In TV they said this morning that the victim was a martial artist and he resisted the first robber. Then he was shot by the second thug who waited in a car or did not appear first..

Beware of the tail gunner!
These scumbags usually operate in a pack.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby americorps » Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:30 pm

Sergio, it is refreshing to see someone stick with the facts. The tarapoto crowd has no need for facts UNLESS they support their opinion.

The facts about living in the jungle regions are very different than are presented on this board. Higher crime and drug use than in Lima, more HIV and STD´s, a much shorter life expextancy in general is all well documented for the jungle regions, useless facts on this board, however, because they do not support the point of view the tarapoto crowd wishes to present.

You are right, crime, especially violent crime, is lowering in most of the west while it is rising in Peru, and not just in Lima or the coast. There are also more and more pirates operating in the rivers of the jungle robbing passanger, tourist and cargo ships. Gaston was robbed just last year while cruising the jungle.

it is the constant barrage of trolls and false information tolerated on this board why I spend a lot less time here than I used to. I do not suffer fools well, so again, thanks for the intellegent and factual addition to the dialogue. Our community needs more of that.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby chi chi » Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:53 am

americorps wrote:The facts about living in the jungle regions are very different than are presented on this board. Higher crime and drug use than in Lima.


Higher crime and drug use in Tarapoto than in Lima??? ha ha ha :lol: :lol: :lol:

In Tarapoto, shops don't have metal bars in front of their windows and heavily armed security guards. You can sleep here with your windows open (again without metal bars) and children can play freely on the street without any worries at all. People leave their motorbike on the street unattended all day.

After dark, people go out in Tarapoto and can walk on the street without any worries at all. In Lima, people lock themselves in their house at night and the mean streets of Lima are deserted after dark.

Americorps, it sounds that you haven't been further yet than the Parque Kennedy area in Miraflores.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby americorps » Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:30 am

just another example, chichi, you speak without having any idea what you are talking about.

You say things that are not true as though they are true without any factual evidence to back you up.

I was taught better than that.

You are dishonest.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby teamoperu » Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:09 am

I am not complaining, but this terrible incident seems to have been missed by the NA press, haven't seen or heard a peep.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby JanD » Wed Sep 04, 2013 12:32 pm

ChiChi, last month I spent some time in Tarapoto.
One day, on our way from Tarapoto to Lamas, we were stopped by two men in some kind of uniform, armed with shotguns asking for a contribution for guarding the road.
The same happened when travelling by cab from Tarapoto to Yurimaguas and from Tarapoto to Moyobamba.
One of the cab drivers told me that on a Friday night abt. a month ago on the road from Tarapoto to Mayobamba abt. 20 people had been robbed by armed tugs. He told me that it was suspected that those armed guards (who were nowhere to be seen that night on that road) might have been the robbers....
Never and nowhere in Tarapoto I felt unsafe during the day- or nighttime (btw in Lima the same in a lot of barrios), but to suggest that Tarapoto is heaven in Peru, is a bit to much.....
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Sergio Bernales » Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:00 pm

JanD wrote:ChiChi, last month I spent some time in Tarapoto.
One day, on our way from Tarapoto to Lamas, we were stopped by two men in some kind of uniform, armed with shotguns asking for a contribution for guarding the road.
The same happened when travelling by cab from Tarapoto to Yurimaguas and from Tarapoto to Moyobamba.
One of the cab drivers told me that on a Friday night abt. a month ago on the road from Tarapoto to Mayobamba abt. 20 people had been robbed by armed tugs. He told me that it was suspected that those armed guards (who were nowhere to be seen that night on that road) might have been the robbers....
Never and nowhere in Tarapoto I felt unsafe during the day- or nighttime (btw in Lima the same in a lot of barrios), but to suggest that Tarapoto is heaven in Peru, is a bit to much.....


Ah, so the jungle paradise isn't perfect...
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby curlyguy18 » Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:14 pm

What happened (happens) in Lima, happens pretty much everywhere in the world, and yes, in some places more frequently than in others.

A man walked into a cinema with rifles and shot a bunch of people dead in the USA. Something similar happened in a school in the USA. An African-American was killed in Florida by a white American of Hispanic descent.

Is crime any worse here than in the US? Let's hope I don't get "we're not discussing crime in America" comments.

Just my 2 cents.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Philipc4u59 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:36 am

I also don't want to participate in a "where is crime worse" posting; but:
If you or a family member are a victim of CRIME; the criminal will face JUSTICE (usually, unless he/she can afford a great defense attorney or the prosecutor/district attorney is an elected moron (does happen).

In the Latin American countries I have visited; there is precedent that if YOU committed a crime in that country - usually you can make a "contribution" to select people & the charges will be lessened or "go away".
If YOU were the victim; hope that the above - doesn't apply to your situation.

With the recent incarceration of the two (2) young women for attempted drug smuggling: I am pleased to see the Peruvian government is extremely strict on cocaine - the "drug of Satan".

Laws need to be equally applied & enforced...

Philip :roll:
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby KenBE » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:27 am

curlyguy18 wrote:What happened (happens) in Lima, happens pretty much everywhere in the world, and yes, in some places more frequently than in others.

A man walked into a cinema with rifles and shot a bunch of people dead in the USA. Something similar happened in a school in the USA. An African-American was killed in Florida by a white American of Hispanic descent.

Is crime any worse here than in the US? Let's hope I don't get "we're not discussing crime in America" comments.

Just my 2 cents.

Curlyguy, you are Peruvian right? Have you ever been robbed or mugged? What about your friends/family?
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby tupacperu » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:29 am

Some assume that because he was in La Victoria he may have been into something shady.
I read an article that he lived there with his Peruvian girlfriend. He was also a martial arts expert and fought back. At that point they shot him, when attempting to fight back.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Philipc4u59 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:26 am

As difficult as it can be to turn over your money & valuables to some "thugs"; they can be replaced.
When I was a body-guard for a wealthy construction guy in Costa Rica; I had to constantly be aware of any situations we were in & make a quick decision to use the gun I had concealed on my person.

In San Jose, I was 2 blocks away from 3 "scum brats" trying to take the purse of a 40's something woman; she resisted & had her arm severed close to the elbow.. Not sure if it was attached w/o issues; JUST SAY - YES!!!

SAY YES, to living another day to enjoy your life, your family, your friends. Resisting just makes the situation even worse! Please be prepared to "JUST SAY - YES"; God will punish the wicked for their evil ways...

Philip :roll:
PS - caliguy is an expat from CA; a great guy - his wife is Peruvian (both lovely people).
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby patricia78 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:10 pm

I have read the comments from a previous page that are now locked. I felt compelled to respond somehow. This American, Christopher, was the love of my sister's life! I assure you this was a violent random act. They did not do drugs, they did not sell drugs. They were two people in love, quietly raising their kids. My sister has read the comments and to say they were hurtful would be an understatement. This wonderful man was also someone's son and brother, and your words hurt them as well. In the future please speculate a little more carefully, and choose your words wisely.
Thank you.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby curlyguy18 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:23 pm

KenBE wrote:Curlyguy, you are Peruvian right? Have you ever been robbed or mugged? What about your friends/family?


Yes, I am Pervuvian and yes, I have been mugged both here in Peru and abroad. I have friends and family that have also been robbed in Lima and outside the country.

I'm with Philipc4u59 whe he says valuables can be replaced and whe he says that in some Latin American countries you can bribe people, but that is not always the case and it's not like it doesn't happen in the first world. It may happen to a lesser degree, but it DOES happen.

My point is sometimes we can pass judgement on other countries without looking at our own countries first. There may be less crime and corruption in Europe than there is here, but they're alive and well over there, too.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby americorps » Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:53 pm

Curly,

I am afraid that I do not understand your point.

Yes, crime and corruption happen everywhere in the world.

That does NOT change the FACT that crime is growing in Peru.

That does not change the FACT that Corruption hinders justice in Peru.

This is a forum about our lives in Peru.

That fact that this story occurs elswhere with more or less frequency does not change how it effects us here today.

I have never understood those that feel that we can ONLY talk about our experiences here if we compare them to other countries.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby curlyguy18 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:11 pm

americorps wrote:I have never understood those that feel that we can ONLY talk about our experiences here if we compare them to other countries.


Because they make it sound as if it only happened here (Peru and Latin America) and not in the "first" world.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby KenBE » Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:12 pm

curlyguy18 wrote:
KenBE wrote:Curlyguy, you are Peruvian right? Have you ever been robbed or mugged? What about your friends/family?


Yes, I am Pervuvian and yes, I have been mugged both here in Peru and abroad. I have friends and family that have also been robbed in Lima and outside the country.

I'm with Philipc4u59 whe he says valuables can be replaced and whe he says that in some Latin American countries you can bribe people, but that is not always the case and it's not like it doesn't happen in the first world. It may happen to a lesser degree, but it DOES happen.

My point is sometimes we can pass judgement on other countries without looking at our own countries first. There may be less crime and corruption in Europe than there is here, but they're alive and well over there, too.

Curlyguy, I asked you this because I was almost certain you were going to say yes. Almost every Peruvian I know has been mugged at least once. Of course crime happens everywhere, but you have to admit that things are pretty bad in Peru right now.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby americorps » Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:21 pm

curlyguy18 wrote:
americorps wrote:I have never understood those that feel that we can ONLY talk about our experiences here if we compare them to other countries.


Because they make it sound as if it only happened here (Peru and Latin America) and not in the "first" world.


This is not a compar and contrast site, this is a site about our lives here in Peru. I do not see the need to always qualify our experience based on other people´s experiences in other countries.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Philipc4u59 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:36 pm

My comments, that I wish everyone would take seriously; are "JUST SAY - YES!"
I have had a cell phone taken from my pocket on a crowded bus; this is the extent of personal crime in Peru.
I am a big guy; but not big enough (nor ever will be) to STOP A BULLET or a KNIFE PLACED TO MY THROAT.

Kevin, just some suggestions to help people survive crime; as they will encounter in Peru & other countries.
Always go in a group of people, possibly wear a whistle around your neck; do anything to thwart an attack.
If worse comes to worse; JUST SAY - YES!!!

Philip :roll:
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby KenBE » Thu Sep 05, 2013 2:29 pm

Philipc4u59 wrote:My comments, that I wish everyone would take seriously; are "JUST SAY - YES!"
I have had a cell phone taken from my pocket on a crowded bus; this is the extent of personal crime in Peru.
I am a big guy; but not big enough (nor ever will be) to STOP A BULLET or a KNIFE PLACED TO MY THROAT.

Kevin, just some suggestions to help people survive crime; as they will encounter in Peru & other countries.
Always go in a group of people, possibly wear a whistle around your neck; do anything to thwart an attack.
If worse comes to worse; JUST SAY - YES!!!

Philip :roll:

I agree. When my Peruvian ex was robbed at gunpoint the first time, she panicked and ran. She was lucky the choros didn't shoot her. It can be hard to react rationally when someone points a gun at you.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby ironchefchris » Thu Sep 05, 2013 2:53 pm

americorps wrote:
curlyguy18 wrote:
americorps wrote:I have never understood those that feel that we can ONLY talk about our experiences here if we compare them to other countries.


Because they make it sound as if it only happened here (Peru and Latin America) and not in the "first" world.


This is not a compar and contrast site, this is a site about our lives here in Peru. I do not see the need to always qualify our experience based on other people´s experiences in other countries.


I think it's pretty obvious crime exists all over the world, including the first world. Depending on the post, and the poster, it is all about compare and contrast. "Why can't things in Peru be more like...." "Things are so much easier/better in ...... compared to Peru."

When I'm in dodgier areas I carry nothing of value and keep my money in a wallet that attaches to my leg. I keep some money in my pocket to be offered should I be robbed, figuring a thug might be mad enough to harm me if I say I have nothing, but hopefully will accept the sixty or so Soles in my pants pocket.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Alan » Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:12 pm

patricia78 wrote:I have read the comments from a previous page that are now locked. I felt compelled to respond somehow. This American, Christopher, was the love of my sister's life! I assure you this was a violent random act. They did not do drugs, they did not sell drugs. They were two people in love, quietly raising their kids. My sister has read the comments and to say they were hurtful would be an understatement. This wonderful man was also someone's son and brother, and your words hurt them as well. In the future please speculate a little more carefully, and choose your words wisely.
Thank you.


I am very sorry for your family's loss. It must be terrible to lose somebody this way, particularly when they are so far away.

There have been a few people on the board who are willing to help your family if the embassy falls short. I don´t know... paperwork.. that kind of thing. Please PM.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby MarcoPE » Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:48 pm

First, to Patricia, our hearts go out to you and your family for your loss, especially your sister and her children. I can't even imagine the pain and hurt I would feel if this happened to my loved one.

Second, let me apologize on behalf of the posters who made assumptions without knowing any facts. Most likely, as a result of this tragedy, some expats have a sense of vulnerability, and it makes some feel better to think that "well, he must have been doing something illegal..."

To ALL of us here, in reality, this tragedy could have happened to ANY SINGLE ONE of us - expat, tourist, or Peruvian - and sure La Victoria is considered more dangerous than some other areas, but this could have happened on any street or any park, anywhere - La Victoria, Miraflores or yes, even Tarapoto.

Again, Patricia, my deepest sympathies to your and your family.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Philipc4u59 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:04 pm

There are a few posters that are continually making assumption & interjecting info that is way "off topic"; this causes a lot of anxiety/pain to sincere posters.

In this case; the victims family has been also been a VICTIM of expatperu; the mods need to control these un-empathetic more closely or people will not want to post! I have numerous people that contact me in this regard; but they should be contacting Alan...

Philip :roll:
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby curlyguy18 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:47 pm

First of all, my deepest condolences to Patricia and her family. My thoughts and prayers are with them.

Americorps, this forum may is about our lives in Peru, but as I said before, a lot of people make it sound like lots of bad things happen here (which is undeniably true) as if nothing happened in their own countries. Sometimes it comes across as if Peru or Latin America were a horrible place and their countries are all but perfect.

KenBe, crime has always been an issue in Peru. In my opinion, I don't think it's got any worse over the last 10 years or more. Just my opinion. (I think this is being discussed in a different post).
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby MarcoPE » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:12 pm

Philipc4u59 wrote:There are a few posters that are continually making assumption & interjecting info that is way "off topic"; this causes a lot of anxiety/pain to sincere posters.

In this case; the victims family has been also been a VICTIM of expatperu; the mods need to control these un-empathetic more closely or people will not want to post! I have numerous people that contact me in this regard; but they should be contacting Alan...

Philip :roll:


Really, Philip? You are gonna use this particular topic to make more derogatory statements about how Expat Peru is run? Seriously inappropriate (though I guess we should be grateful that you didn't include the words: "CONSUMER ADVOCATE, COFFEE SAMPLES, or WIN-WIN")! Though I know YOU think YOU should have a big delete button next to all of our usernames, Alan is the only one who truly has one .... and I have to say, he is an amazingly patient soul.

curlyguy18 wrote:Americorps, this forum may is about our lives in Peru, but as I said before, a lot of people make it sound like lots of bad things happen here (which is undeniably true) as if nothing happened in their own countries. Sometimes it comes across as if Peru or Latin America were a horrible place and their countries are all but perfect.


americorps wrote:I have never understood those that feel that we can ONLY talk about our experiences here if we compare them to other countries.


I agree with Kevin on this one but, ... (not saying anyone else is wrong, everyone is entitled to their opinion) the name of this site is Expat Peru and though I am concerned with crime in my home country (yes, bad) and world-wide for that matter (also bad), being an expat living in Peru, I am much more concerned about what is happening closest to my front door and closest to my family here. I think that is what you are seeing here and I also think most on this site understand that crime in their own country can be just as bad or worse than anywhere else...including Peru.

However, in my essentially meaningless opinion, if we continue to spend our time comparing crime X in Peru with crime Y in the US (as if that provides some sort of relevant justification) instead of having a serious dialogue about crime where we live (Peru for many of us - and that dialogue will most likely include some harsh criticisms), we will never be able to solve the actual problem .. crime, and violent crime in particular..... here or anywhere.

Just 2 cents more.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby caliguy » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:13 pm

patricia78 wrote:I have read the comments from a previous page that are now locked. I felt compelled to respond somehow. This American, Christopher, was the love of my sister's life! I assure you this was a violent random act. They did not do drugs, they did not sell drugs. They were two people in love, quietly raising their kids. My sister has read the comments and to say they were hurtful would be an understatement. This wonderful man was also someone's son and brother, and your words hurt them as well. In the future please speculate a little more carefully, and choose your words wisely.
Thank you.

Speaking on behalf of myself and others on this forum, We are deeply sorry to hear about the loss of your friend. Please Accept our sincerest apologies and empathy from any previous posts.
every place has it's own spirit. you just need to tune into it.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby falconagain » Fri Sep 06, 2013 1:39 am

curlyguy18 wrote:KenBe, crime has always been an issue in Peru. In my opinion, I don't think it's got any worse over the last 10 years or more. Just my opinion. (I think this is being discussed in a different post).


Lima : Meet PNP statistics about insecurity

Home LimaLima : Know PNP statistics about insecurity
Saturday, March 17, 2012 | 9:50 pm

Lima : Meet PNP statistics about insecurity ciudadanaFuente : RPP According to the police , organized gangs multiplied by 64 % , a fact that is corroborated by the dismantling of 238 of them during January and February 2012 .

Today, insecurity is one of the main features of all Metroplitana Lima we live , a factor that multiplies violence , and , in turn, causes uncertainty in the districts.

The alarming crime

The levels of crime , drug use and prostitution in the capital of Peru are each year more alarming , as described by the National Police statistics . For example, during the months of January and February of 2012 , the number of people requisitoriadas number amounted to 2536 , ie there was an increased of 121% over the previous year .

This trend is also reflected in the comparative table of the detainees , exceeding 98% , in other words , reached the sum of 5467 , revealing that arithmetic increased from a giant on the first city of Peru .

This is almost proportional to the number of weapons seized , which was achieved by day 2.6 confiscate average over the same range of the above cases , reaching 175.
 
On the other hand , the proliferation of gangs multiplied , proves the operations conducted by the men in green , which broke up 238 of them , ie, 64 % compared to the period January to February 2011.

The main streets of the districts are not spared gang stalking . And figures from the police provide an overview of the problem : during the first two months of the year 7000 stood at 752 , an amount that was increased by 68 % .

The transport noise , prostitution and drugs

The operations to penalize carriers for breaking the rules also top police digits . In the first 60 days , was prescribed 225 000 461 ballots imposed , seeing increased by 285 % in the same period compared to 2011 .

In category of drugs , more than 118 000 301 3000 411 ketes and marijuana were seized cops during January and February by the police , values ​​were increased 117% and 98.5 % , respectively.

Moreover, prostitution is one of the problems that has spread , because according to 7000 statistics 82 prostitutes were operated in the same range , meaning an increase of 342 %.

http://www.rpp.com.pe/2012-03-17-lima-c ... 62402.html


According to the Police things went to hell between 2011 and 2012. So I am guessing that the SHTF now
because crime has incremented even more. Now the police Statistics show that there has been an
increase starting from 2008 to today. Now Lima was also declared the most unsafe city of Peru

Lima - Sábado, 15 de Septiembre del 2012 | 11:29 am
http://www.americatv.com.pe/portal/noti ... a-del-pa-s

What is going on Curly, you are not watching the local news at least.
Cifras revelaron que Lima es la ciudad más insegura del país
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Philipc4u59 » Fri Sep 06, 2013 7:50 am

MarcoPE & others of interest,

I wasn't aware that expatperu or Peru in general was a "communist" entity?
I cherish the freedom of expression/speech I enjoyed in the US & I desire to enjoy same in expatperu.
Please don't lower your self to the "Troll Triad" & post business/personal attacks upon me?

This will help with the true "Troll Triad" not seeing this as an "invitation" to do like-wise.
Your post is "Off Topic"; if Kelly was still a moderator - it would have been deleted.
I can accept that Alan & Kelly have different "styles" of moderation; but I prefer the stricter standards.

Enjoy you day,
Philip :|
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby KenBE » Fri Sep 06, 2013 9:52 am

curlyguy18 wrote:Sometimes it comes across as if Peru or Latin America were a horrible place and their countries are all but perfect.

KenBe, crime has always been an issue in Peru. In my opinion, I don't think it's got any worse over the last 10 years or more. Just my opinion. (I think this is being discussed in a different post).


Peru is a great country, and I love it, BUT, it is a country with very high crime levels. In fact that is just about the only thing I don't like about Peru.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby ironchefchris » Fri Sep 06, 2013 3:46 pm

Philip,

Once again, you confuse me with someone else. I made no comment that the unfortunate victim's family would consider "un-empathetic." Perhaps you are referring to Chi Chi who made the baseless and hurtful suggestion that the victim must have been involved in drugs or had an outstanding debt to warrant such an attack. Do you have anything to say about that? I made no comment until AFTER the sister of the girlfriend of the victim made her post about hurtful comments. I commented on americorps comment (about expatperu not being a compare and contrast to other countries site) which was a response to curlyguy18 on the topic of crime in Peru and the rest of the world. I then added my thoughts on how I would hopefully avoid a worse situation should I unfortunately find myself a victim of crime. Hardly "off topic." Once again, I made no libelous, false, or defamatory statements. You were not mentioned. I'm sorry you have a problem with my (and others) exercising our free speech while only being concerned about your own.

Your comment was about how my comment, and by extension americorps and curlyguy18, on whose posts I was commenting, are off topic as well as MarcoPE, and then went on (or should I say 'off?) to make the topic all about you - i.e. your "anxiety/pain," etc,.

Stay classy.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Gg83 » Fri Sep 06, 2013 4:13 pm

I was not sure if i should write here a comment or not. i dont feel / or see the point of me saying something about what happend. My fiance was killed on sunday. The love of my life was studying minuts before he went to the store to purchase dog food and a coke. He was a decent man, loving and he never had any kind of issues with anyone. Everyone in our area knew him thats why maybe he was confortable going to the store at night. he fought not for a cellphone. he tried to protect children close to him.I know my Chris... i know him very well.. so well that i know what he was thinking and i know how he didnt see it coming. We live in a world where for some people .. life means nothing. Life meant everything for Chris. He had a good heart and was an amazing person. Our children have to deal with the loss of the only man who ever really loved and took care of them... and i ve to deal with the loss of my best friend, my love, my hope. I wanna thank you all for the good supportive mssges and i if you can share the link where his family is raising funds to take him home.

http://www.youcaring.com/memorial-fundr ... home/85755

My pain goes beyond words can describe, and right now i just want him to rest where he grew up and where his family is. i want his family to have a chance to say goodbye just like i had mine. i just want him out of that awful place where he is now , alone.. since he got here i never left his side. so this is very difficult for me. Thank you all so much for everything.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Graced » Fri Sep 06, 2013 6:15 pm

His name was Christopher Caver and his family is desperate for information. They are currently in the process of trying to raise money to bring his body home. He is an Army Veteran served 2 tours in Iraq.
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Alan » Fri Sep 06, 2013 7:23 pm

Gg83 wrote:I was not sure if i should write here a comment or not. i dont feel / or see the point of me saying something about what happend. My fiance was killed on sunday. The love of my life was studying minuts before he went to the store to purchase dog food and a coke. He was a decent man, loving and he never had any kind of issues with anyone. Everyone in our area knew him thats why maybe he was confortable going to the store at night. he fought not for a cellphone. he tried to protect children close to him.I know my Chris... i know him very well.. so well that i know what he was thinking and i know how he didnt see it coming. We live in a world where for some people .. life means nothing. Life meant everything for Chris. He had a good heart and was an amazing person. Our children have to deal with the loss of the only man who ever really loved and took care of them... and i ve to deal with the loss of my best friend, my love, my hope. I wanna thank you all for the good supportive mssges and i if you can share the link where his family is raising funds to take him home.

http://www.youcaring.com/memorial-fundr ... home/85755

My pain goes beyond words can describe, and right now i just want him to rest where he grew up and where his family is. i want his family to have a chance to say goodbye just like i had mine. i just want him out of that awful place where he is now , alone.. since he got here i never left his side. so this is very difficult for me. Thank you all so much for everything.



Because of the delicate nature of the topic, I spoke to this woman by telephone to see if she was legit. (I don´t put anything past some of the people who troll this board).

She is legitimate.

The request for money to ship the body was placed by the family 6 days ago, and she has simply reposted the link.



--alan
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby gringito » Fri Sep 06, 2013 8:58 pm

I have allowed myself to also post this link
http://www.youcaring.com/memorial-fundr ... home/85755
in another large Peru expat community
since I feel it may help...
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby Alpineprince » Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:23 am

Alan wrote:
Gg83 wrote:I was not sure if i should write here a comment or not. i dont feel / or see the point of me saying something about what happend. My fiance was killed on sunday. The love of my life was studying minuts before he went to the store to purchase dog food and a coke. He was a decent man, loving and he never had any kind of issues with anyone. Everyone in our area knew him thats why maybe he was confortable going to the store at night. he fought not for a cellphone. he tried to protect children close to him.I know my Chris... i know him very well.. so well that i know what he was thinking and i know how he didnt see it coming. We live in a world where for some people .. life means nothing. Life meant everything for Chris. He had a good heart and was an amazing person. Our children have to deal with the loss of the only man who ever really loved and took care of them... and i ve to deal with the loss of my best friend, my love, my hope. I wanna thank you all for the good supportive mssges and i if you can share the link where his family is raising funds to take him home.

http://www.youcaring.com/memorial-fundr ... home/85755

My pain goes beyond words can describe, and right now i just want him to rest where he grew up and where his family is. i want his family to have a chance to say goodbye just like i had mine. i just want him out of that awful place where he is now , alone.. since he got here i never left his side. so this is very difficult for me. Thank you all so much for everything.



Because of the delicate nature of the topic, I spoke to this woman by telephone to see if she was legit. (I don´t put anything past some of the people who troll this board).

She is legitimate.

The request for money to ship the body was placed by the family 6 days ago, and she has simply reposted the link.



--alan

I am also very sorry for your families loss.

Alan, thank you for verifying this information, I hope the Expat community can get together here and "do the right thing"!
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Re: American citizen murdered in La Victoria

Postby curlyguy18 » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:51 pm

However, in my essentially meaningless opinion, if we continue to spend our time comparing crime X in Peru with crime Y in the US (as if that provides some sort of relevant justification) instead of having a serious dialogue about crime where we live (Peru for many of us - and that dialogue will most likely include some harsh criticisms), we will never be able to solve the actual problem .. crime, and violent crime in particular..... here or anywhere.


You're right, MarcoPE. I really like your (not meaningless) opinion here. It is true this is a site about Peru and our lives here. Again, sometimes it just comes across as though some people like to trash Peru and Latin America without looking at their own countries.

And yes, there is no denying that Lima is a dangerous city, like many other metropolis around the world (either to a greater or lesser degree).

Jr.

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