Cost of living in Peru / Relocating to Lima

Answers to your qestions about moving to, and living in, Peru,
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Cost of living in Peru / Relocating to Lima

Postby z28com » Sat Jun 03, 2006 7:34 pm

I met my wife in Miami. Her family moved to the US in 2000. I've been telling her that I want to move to Lima. We can barely get by here in the US since all of the real estate prices have gone to the moon. For most people to qualify for a mortgage, you're supposed to be earning roughly 1/3rd of the price of a home. Well, most of the homes in Miami and Ft. Lauderdale are like $400,000 to $600,000. I'm sorry, but I don't make a 6-figure income. I think that's pretty insane to have to make that kind of money just to buy a house here unless you were lucky enough to buy a house years ago.

She has told me how broke everybody is living in Lima and how her father was always out of work and that's why they moved here. So if we decided to move there and for us to get jobs, it would be insane and she would be poor all over again.

I got involved in a network marketing thing back in 2002 and it's been making me more and more money each year. I was thinking that we could move down there and live off of this income and then maybe I could get a job for some extra cash.

What I'm trying to figure out is if $6,000 Nuevo Sol's per month will be enough to live on comfortably.

I keep seeing various prices posted in messages here, but I can't always tell if these prices and/or salaries mentioned are in US Dollars or Nuevo Sol's.

When people talk about apartments costing $300/mo., is that $300 USD or $300 Nuevo Sol's?

Like to go to Outback Steakhouse or Olive Garden, we can spend $40 to $60 USD on dinner for 2. How many Sol's will it cost to eat in most restaurants there?

Also, is $6,000 Nuevo Sol's plenty enough to live on or is that just enough to get by? My wife refuses to answer any of my questions and has no desire to move back. Sometimes my checks can be as high as $11,000 Nuevo Sol's per month.

Since I've never been out of the country, I don't know how good I could live on that. Plus since these checks would be US Dollars, I am given a 1099-MISC on this income and have to pay taxes on it. If you earn the income while living abroad, do you still have to pay the same amount of taxes?

I spoke with my father-in-law and asked him if we lived in Lima and we had $10,000 Nuevo Sol's, how good could we live? He said we'd be rich. Is this true?

I've searched many web pages about Lima, but I keep getting prices in USD. I want to see the Nuevo Sol prices. I also read that post about the Etrade account. That also looks good.

My other issue is that I don't think my MLM company will mail commission checks out of the country. They only send to people in the USA and Canada. From what I was told, I would not be allowed to sell my products outside the US. My products are motor oil and they said each country has different rules and regulations about importing such products.

My other issue is getting a car. If I did actually make $6,000+ Nuevo Sol's per month, how much would car payments be? Like here you could buy a brand new Toyota Yaris or Hyundai Accent and pay maybe $250-350/mo. How much would a new car purchased at a car dealer in Lima cost?

Since the income I make is derived from an MLM, it fluctuates greatly. One month I could gross $1,800 and another month could be $3,200.

So $1,800 would roughly be approx. $6,100 Nuevo Sol's and $3,200 would be approx. $10,900 Nuevo Sol's, correct?

She was 18 when she left the country and was not really responsible for paying bills at her young age, so she really doesn't know much about the cost of living.

I was thinking that if this money kept coming, we could retire at a young age and just relocate to Lima. Does this all sound feasible?

I could still maintain my web site from there if I was able to get a Cable Modem. I use Vonage. I'm just hoping that there will be enough bandwidth and then I could still run a business from home but do it there instead of my bedroom from Florida.


Remy

Re: My wife wa..wanting to move from US to Lima

Postby Remy » Sun Jun 04, 2006 1:52 pm

Your wife does not want to return to Peru because of status probably. Peru is a third-world country.

With 6000 soles monthly you can have a wealthy life here with a fancy appartment, a good car and loads of fun. Food in good restaurants --for 2 people--will not exceed $30 and it is half if you go to a nice Peruvian restaurant. A very classy appartment you'll have for $600 and for 300$ you'll pay water, electricity and other expenses for the house; including supermarket expenses. All based on a wealthy life-style; if you want to have a good life, then for $700 all-in you'll be a happy bloke.

The only concern for you to have is (political) stability. The current elections are a race between a nationalist (Hugo Chavez clone) and a man who --as president--brought Peru to the near abyss in the 80's. Whatever you do, keep your money in an American bank account.

Vonage works.. I have the system here as well.. you just have to bring your router with you and here you buy a 110V transformer. For $45 a month you have a decent Internet connection that allows you to have good calls to and from the US.

But let me give you one advise. There is nothing more deadly than the unhappiness of a woman, so beware.
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man...

Postby z28com » Sun Jun 04, 2006 2:00 pm

My wife just read your reply and she literally punched me in the face telling me that we're only going to visit and not move. I've been trying to convince her how well off we'd be living there. Sometimes my checks are good and I could have up to $11,000 Sol's in a month!

She's waiting for her papers here to be complete so she can be a permanent resident in the US and then she wants to sponsor her family who live here now.

The problem living here in the US is that when I make $2000 USD per month, our bills are like $4,000. Moving to Lima, you get to enjoy the wealth of the currency conversion. It's like people moving from Europe to the US. They get more money for their Euro since the Euro is worth much more than the USD.

Hopefully we'll get some money saved and then we will be able to take a trip down there to visit.

I've been looking at the prices of used cars on here. One person wanted $1,000 for some old '74 Toyota. Are they insane? I bought one of those here, 10 years ago, for $150 bucks!

How much is a brand new car from the dealer in Lima?
Remy

Re: man...

Postby Remy » Sun Jun 04, 2006 2:33 pm

Regarding your wife, well, what she does is what a lot of Peruvians do. Can't blame them. My wife and I lived abroad and she wanted to go back to Peru as quickly as possible, because she could net get used to the life-style. Now I have to say that my wife comes from the B-class here in Lima and that means that your life is not at all bad. Lower social classes have more troubles to get around, so an extra financial aid from relatives abroad is very welcome.

About cars? Actually, I don't have a car, because with a $3 taxi-ride an can get all over town, so why bother?
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Moving back

Postby z28com » Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:13 pm

The thing is, my wife DOES NOT want to go back to Peru. We have a beautiful brand new, 3 bedroom, 2 bath, 2 car garage here in the US. I told her that we could sell it and buy a beautiful place in Peru near the beach.

I've been fighter with her every single day telling her I want to move to Peru. Since she was poor when she lived in Peru, that's all she can remember. I can't convince her that if she goes back, we'll have $6,000 to $11,000 Nuevo Sol per month to live on!

I just don't know what that will buy. When you say $3 for a taxi, is that $3 USD or $3 Nuevo Sol?
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Postby michelle_cart » Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:26 pm

When the $ sign is used here it means US Dollars, the sign for soles is S/.

eg $3.00 is 3 dollars and S/.3.00 is 3 soles
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thx

Postby z28com » Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:30 pm

I appreciate that information. Why do some people put a "." in front of the money? I get confused and don't know if it's dollars or cents.

What can I do to convince my wife to move back to Peru?

How much does a new car there cost compared to one in the US?

Are the Japanese cars cheaper? My wife told me that American cars in Peru are very expensive. I'd rather get a Honda or Toyota if I could convince her to move back.

If we really did have 6,000 Sol's per month, where could we live? If 54% of Peruvians live on $150-200 per month, where are these apartments that they livein? The places I keep finding are $500-700/mo. which is the same as living in the US. The whole purpose for me to move to Peru WOULD TO BE TO LIVE CHEAP, not the same as I do here now.
Remy

Re: thx

Postby Remy » Mon Jun 05, 2006 9:49 am

I don't know where in the US you live, but where I have been I could not find an appartment with jacuzzi in the richest part of town, guards and about 150m2 for $600. What makes Peru so cheap is the food in the supermarkets (especially veggies and fruit) and manual labour.

Anyway, your problem is not about the money; trust me. Your wife just does not want to go, because she must know that for 6000 soles a month you can a life that every American/European would dream of.
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Postby Arroz con Pollo » Mon Jun 05, 2006 10:30 am

I have been here almost 2 months. I live in a very nice area of Lima, Miraflores. I have an 1100 sq ft 2 BR/1.5bath apartment in a secured highrise. I have an elevator that opens right into my apartment. This costs me $300/mo plus 200 soles for the maintenance fees. So about $365/month. My light bill is about $30, that is including the 2 computers I keep on all day long (for my work) and I tend to keep the hot water heater on longer than most people. My girlfriend is constantly yelling at me about this. That is one adjustment I hate, I am use to keeping my hotwater on 24/7, but if you have electric powered hot water, you actually have a swtich to turn it on/off... and are expected to do so. I have gas for food and have a standard propane tank as many people do in Lima. It cost me about $30 for the gas and installation back in early April, I still have plenty left.

I have to pay 150 soles ($45) quarterly for Miraflores municiple fees. I use prepaid cell phone and it is rather inexpensive. My home phone + internet is my major expense. I run an internet business so I shell out the coin for the 900k dsl, it is the 2nd fastest speed offered, 1200 being the fastest. Including phone and internet I pay about $120/month.

Like other's have mentioned food, clothes and daily living needs are where you really save money. My girlfriend and I can go to get local chinese food, for about $5. There is a restaurant called "La Romana" in San Isidro, we went there for our annivesary. We each had lasagna, I had 2 glasses of wine, we also had desert. The total check was about $15. The guy nearly crapped his pants when I left a 10 sole tip. I can go to the local store, buy 15 rolls, a half pound of ham and cheese for about 11 soles (3-4 bucks).

If you can run a business from here and earn a moderate American salary, you can live very comfortably. I could be living even better than I am now, but I am trying to save money in the event I am out of work. I try to keep enough money in the bank to be able to live here at least 6 months without work.
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WOW!

Postby z28com » Mon Jun 05, 2006 12:56 pm

This is very upsetting to see this. This makes me want to move there even more.

I pay USD $44.95/mo. for my cable modem which is 7 Mbps:
http://cfl.mybrighthouse.com/products_and_pricing/prices/default.aspx

They advertise on TV that it's 10 Mbps. I've downloaded two 118 meg files simutaneously and it said each file was downloading at about 300 KB/Sec.

I will certainly miss this cheap bandwidth if we move down there.

Yes, I would definitly be giving 10 Sol tips at restaurants. I usually tip $5 to $7 here, so that would be 15 to 21 Sol's as a tip here.

I really need to save up a couple grand to fly down there with my wife to see what it's really like.

I know when we eat Chinese take out here in Florida, it would be about the same as paying 60 Nuevo Sol's down there. So I can see how cheap the food would be if we lived down there WHICH WOULD BE FANTASTIC!

One of the big reasons I would love to move there is because I hate to cook. If we could realistically bring in 6,000 to 10,000 Nuevo Sol's per month, I would like to eat out at restaurants 7 days per week.

Also, is it possible to buy nice appliances there?

These are in my house right now:
http://www.greatmotoroil.com/florida/washer-dryer.JPG

Is it possible to find these in Lima? My wife says that nice appliances are very expensive there. Now she's spoiled with all of this stuff and this is one of the reasons she doesn't want to move back to Lima. So I want to be able to buy most of the stuff we have here now.

This is our current house:
http://www.greatmotoroil.com/florida/front-of-house.JPG

This would be about 368,000 Sol's if it were in Lima.
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Postby Allards » Thu Jun 08, 2006 5:59 am

My Peruvian girlfriend cannot stand living in Europe (she hates the coldness), and she wants to return to Lima asap (she’s also form the b-class and graduated from ULIMA) so she will be fine finding a job.

She ones a small house in the North of Lima, we first will move there, improve it bit, Later I’m planning to buy some real-estate in Lima as an investment and to have an apartment closer to work etc…

I estimated that while we are living in the north it will only cost us $ 500 monthly including insurances, speedy and food. Living in Lima is so much cheaper than in the western world but expect it to become more expensive when Peru develops.

If I’m going to work I will need to start my own business, I don’t expect to find a job in Peru (in my case due to lack of consistent schooling), that’s why I’m planning to set up a IT related business, probably serving western markets…I’m convinced there are many huge opportunities waiting to be explored..

I’m looking forward to the day my house here is sold leaving “Communist” Europe!
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Comm.

Postby z28com » Thu Jun 08, 2006 6:08 am

If everybody hates communism so bad and everybody loves the USA so much (as we have TONS and TONS of people from every country wanting to move here), why can't other countries just model their governments to be like ours? I personally think Europe and Peru are BOTH much more beautiful to live in than the USA. I just can't convince my wife to move back to Peru. Any time I try to get one sentence out talking about moving to Peru, she immediately puts her hand in my face and yells, "Stop it." Then I keep saying, "But we'll have 10,000 sol's per month to live on..." and then she'll continue to say, "I don't want to talk about it." It's hilarious.

I guess to her, she'll think we'll be poor on 10,000 nuevo sol's. I have no idea since I can't get any people to tell her how well we could live on that.
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Re: Comm.

Postby Allards » Thu Jun 08, 2006 6:18 am

z28com wrote:If everybody hates communism so bad and everybody loves the USA so much (as we have TONS and TONS of people from every country wanting to move here), why can't other countries just model their governments to be like ours? I personally think Europe and Peru are BOTH much more beautiful to live in than the USA. I just can't convince my wife to move back to Peru. Any time I try to get one sentence out talking about moving to Peru, she immediately puts her hand in my face and yells, "Stop it." Then I keep saying, "But we'll have 10,000 sol's per month to live on..." and then she'll continue to say, "I don't want to talk about it." It's hilarious.

I guess to her, she'll think we'll be poor on 10,000 nuevo sol's. I have no idea since I can't get any people to tell her how well we could live on that.


:idea: Well you could divorce her and find another Chola in Peru who want to stay there. :twisted:

Or try to take it easy with here, step by step...
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Re: Comm.

Postby Allards » Thu Jun 08, 2006 6:19 am

z28com wrote:why can't other countries just model their governments to be like ours?


Fear!
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??

Postby z28com » Thu Jun 08, 2006 9:17 am

Fear of what?!?! All of the people in other countries want what the people in the USA have... big houses, big cars, lots of food, etc. Why can't those countries just copycat whatever the USA is doing?

I don't see why there should be any such thing as a "3rd world country" when anyone can go to the USA and learn how the culture and gov't is run and simply DUPLICATE IT.
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Re: ??

Postby Allards » Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:23 am

z28com wrote:Fear of what?!?! All of the people in other countries want what the people in the USA have... big houses, big cars, lots of food, etc. Why can't those countries just copycat whatever the USA is doing?

I don't see why there should be any such thing as a "3rd world country" when anyone can go to the USA and learn how the culture and gov't is run and simply DUPLICATE IT.


It's not that simple and the US also has a lot of debts, but I think that the innovative power of the US is very strong, that's why it will survive everything.

People I observe in Europe are scared to lose their ‘Welfare’ state.

They like to enjoy the fruits of the free market but they doesn’t want to take risks. That’s why they reject too much free market and of course the US model (only because it’s from the US) They are blind for the results, but they always have some negative points, they immediately turn them into a general rule proofing Free markets are not ok.

That’s why they are scared, they sold their souls to the Welfare Gods!

Even If they are not on welfare now they want to keep the option open for later..
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Welfare

Postby z28com » Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:10 am

I wish they would outlaw welfare and make people go to work unless they have a missing appendage or are a quad. I remember when I was down and out and went to file for that. I saw people driving up driving late model Volvo's and what not.

It took me years of work to get my business to where it is now. And all of the taxes I have to pay are killing me just so people can have free stuff. That's not much difference than them stealing from me and legally getting away with it.
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MOVING FROM FLORIDA TO LIMA PERU DUE TO COST OF LIVING

Postby gypsy » Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:46 am

Do not know what I am doing, but this post called my attention. I am moving back to Lima, Peru, and so is my father, who is 85 years old. Life is not only too expensive in Florida, but life for older people is sad and lonely. There will be no need for a car or car insurance there, for taxi is affordable, and many things like vegetables, eggs, even food, are delivered to your door. It is, indeed, possible for two people to live comfortably on $1,500 dollars a month, and $300 dollars would be for a very small apartment. However, $600 a month will afford a nice three bedroom apartment that is furnished and in a good location. For better living than Lima, I would say Costa Rica, but in my case, I have friends and a tiny old house in Lima, so there I go! I see people selling things from Peru via the internet, and they seem to be doing well. Yes, it is difficult to find a job there, but if you are ingenious, you would do best working for yourself. There is always room for another internet cafe, for instance, and equipment for that is not expensive. I would NOT invest on rental property there, for it is costly, involved, and lengthy to kick out non-paying tenants. Your wife is still young, so she is seeing things as someone still strong enough to make a living, no matter how hard she may have to work. My guess is that she will go back to Lima, in time. I never would have thought I would come to this conclusion, and now I wish I had made the decision much sooner. Another factor is the way houses are built--they do not peel away with the wind there! We are still living the ongoing nightmare left to us from hurricane Charley, and we simply cannot wait to be in Lima! I also do not have health insurance, and I pay $80 for the doctor to prescribe something for my throat ache. When my mother was not well, we had to wheel her to the car and doctors' appointments, and in Lima, for $20 the doctor pays you a visit in your own home. A nurse around the clock is affordable, while here, my father had to leave my mother alone to go grocery shopping, and many times found her on the floor and had to call paramedics to help. One can have a helper there for little money. Oh yes, you will live in a cage, gray and mist many months, with deep pockets and careful with your exact change so it does not get snatched, but I talk to my aunt every day, and, on very modest income, she never has to get on all fours to fix plumbing or cut the grass and lift heavy weight. Be retired here and have more and more heavy work to do as you can afford less and less to pay for help, and see if your wife is not going to want to go back to Lima on moderate retirement income! She will.. But I agree that if you are young and can tough it out, you will eventually rip the benefits of taking more money with you, even if it is only in the way of the sale of your house here. I babbled enough.. No time to edit.. Have to empty the pool before the heavy rain from hurricane Alberto hits us... gypsy
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thanks!

Postby z28com » Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:56 am

I really appreciate that post. I will show it to my wife.

Yes, Florida is getting too expensive. All of the middle class people are trying to get out. It's getting just as bad as California as far as real estate prices. The problem is that housing has gone up like 300 to 500% yet I don't see people who were making $10/hr. all of a sudden getting paid $50/hr. This is the big scam I see and one of the big factors causing me to want to leave here.

I will have to see if we can eventually afford to own two homes. One here and one in Lima. I am looking at trying to drastically cut expenses. Right now we own two vehicles and the combined payments are over $900/mo. Cars are just so expensive now that no matter what vehicle you get, the payments are going to be super high. Gone are the days of buying a brand new vehicle for $7995. That used to be the Hyundai's and Kia's. Now those same $7995 cars are selling for $14,000 today if you're willing to scrape the bottom. A decent car is no less than $20,000 now. It's sickening. Most cars I see people buying now are upwards of $25,000 and up. I don't know how people afford them. Loans on $25,000 to $30,000 run about $500+ per month. Is everybody in South Florida earning $100,000+ per year? Is it just me who's broke?
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Postby detheredge » Mon Jun 12, 2006 12:05 pm

Hey Z28. Here is some more ammo for your wife...

I have dental insurance here in the US, but whenever I have to have a major procedure, it's cheaper for me to fly to Lima and have it done there. I have no dental insurance in Peru and I do have dental insurance in the US and my out of pocket is still cheaper to have it done in Lima. Go figure.

During my last dental appointment in Lima, the dentist asked me to translate some of his favorite Sinatra CDs. Because I did, he bleached my teeth and fixed a chipped tooth for free. Try getting that done in Florida.
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Postby Allards » Mon Jun 12, 2006 12:45 pm

@z28com

If she refuses:
http://www.latindate.net/peruvian_women.htm
:twisted:

But i agree, things are often cheaper in Peru and the service is much better, often your Doctor or Dentist is your friend, (at least our Peruvian Dentist is) :)
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cool

Postby z28com » Mon Jun 12, 2006 12:51 pm

Man, those are classics!!

Yeah, I heard stories about dentists and doctors. Paying a doctor to get something serious done in Lima doesn't seem to be much different than paying a Vet to work on your dog or cat here in the US.
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same boat...

Postby hoot99 » Mon Jun 12, 2006 2:36 pm

you haven't mentioned kids - we have 2 little ones - and i have already gone to peru just to find that private schools there actually discipline their kids - along with i.b. educations! to say the least, ... we're outta here!!
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man

Postby z28com » Mon Jun 12, 2006 3:03 pm

It may not be a good idea for too many people to go to Lima from the US. It may end up driving up prices. The same thing would happen here in the US if people started coming here from Europe converting their Euro's to USD.
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Re: man

Postby Allards » Mon Jun 12, 2006 3:39 pm

z28com wrote:It may not be a good idea for too many people to go to Lima from the US. It may end up driving up prices. The same thing would happen here in the US if people started coming here from Europe converting their Euro's to USD.


Prices could come up a bit in Peru as more people move over, as long as the parasites stay away there is no problem. Whe should be free to live where we choice too (as we pay for ourselves)

Well many things are better in Peru especially when you are a customer, i hope the country could continue to grow while it remains more or less the same. Looking towards the developed world from Peru the Peruvians often think all the grass is greener, often they don't realize what they have at home themselves. Blindly adopting too many things from developing countries should be the most stupid thing the can do, the should know they already do many things much better (not only Peru, but for instance in Eastern Europe they do thing much better as well) and learn form the mistakes of the developed nations.

There are also some things i dislike about Peru:

There is too much pollution in the Big cities.
Too much Dust
The difference between R & P is too big.
Indians try to discriminate white people (FI: You speak to them in perfect Spanish and they play stupid)
Los Piranhas (I hate people who try to rob and steal)
Ollanta Humala / Alan Garcia
Combi's
Telefonica / Speedy Internet
Foreign goods, electronics are more difficult tot get,(less choice)
Mc Donalds it's not the same ;)
etc...

But there are so many things making up for the other inconveniences
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I feel your pain about the cost of living here in S Florida

Postby Joe_uspe » Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:26 pm

It's getting worse every year. I'm also thinking of moving to Peru.

About your wife, I suggest you just get her to visit first. When you are there she will remember the things she misses about Peru and probably be more receptive to the idea of going back. Stop trying to change her mind and find a way to let her change it herself. That is the only way to deal with a stubborn Peruvian woman. Trust me, my mother is Peruvian and my father American. I've seen these issues in action. :)
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Postby gypsy » Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:29 pm

Truth be told, it is not so much that I am dying to move to Lima, but, rather, that I want out of here, and most of my reasons are practical and monetary. If I were moving alone, and doing so ten years earlier, I may have chosen Huanchaco; life is more pleasant there, and a lot cheaper than Lima, but I hear you will have to fly to Lima for major surgery. But then, see how our friend goes to the dentist in Lima! LOL

The only way I have known to save money is to drive a car until it quits and not have car payments, not to have more shoes than I actually wear, and skipping the popcorn at the movie theatre. We simply are spoiled here, but I am ready to live modestly with peace of mind versus lavishly with increasing sources of anxiety. After the hurricanes hit this area, nobody even does a decent honest job at fixing 'unimportant' things like the roof and sidings. So much work to be done that a company comes in to fix roofs and vanishes to turn into a window company. Everything is in the tens of thousands of dollars, while my whole house in Lima will have walls and cement floors torn down, new plumbing, new electrical wiring, toilets, tubs, kitchen, absolutely everything, and I do not think it will get to $10,000 dollars, including appliances! So do not be afraid of purchasing a fixer-upper there--if in a mixed zone (commercial/residential), you may be able to live where you work. Sounds good to me!

My grandfather had a car, but he chose to take the bus to go to work, and read the newspaper on the way. Miraflores, at least where I will be, is noisy with heavy traffic, but I am taking two years worth of earplugs, and it is allright if I do not hear the news when the windows are open. It is all a matter of putting things on a scale. Seems to me that your wife and you have crossed paths going in opposite directions. Has she had a taste of 'true' independence, where she has nobody to help her but herself? And has she seen older people who are no longer able to drive? Reality only started to hit me when my own mother fell ill, though I had noticed even the wealthiest older people I knew were lonely-kids have to work and move away or travel, and distances are greater even within the same town. For some reason, there seems to be less and less time for family gatherings and special dates fade into 'things to do' that swallow one's time. I feel I am living for the house, not in the house, that pulling weeds so the neighbor won't hate crabgrass is just not my cup of tea any longer, and I want to have more time to enjoy what I really want to be doing, not be consumed by what I have to be doing just to stay afloat. Maybe I am old? I would think so, except that my daughter lives in a perennial state of exhaustion and so do her friends! What has happened? I do remember it was not this way 'once upon a time.'

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Re: I feel your pain about the cost of living here in S Flor

Postby Allards » Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:44 am

Joe_uspe wrote: Stop trying to change her mind and find a way to let her change it herself. That is the only way to deal with a stubborn Peruvian woman. :)


That's so truth! :?
Rascarse no ayuda!
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Re: I feel your pain about the cost of living here in S Flor

Postby Arroz con Pollo » Tue Jun 13, 2006 1:54 pm

Joe_uspe wrote: Stop trying to change her mind and find a way to let her change it herself. That is the only way to deal with a stubborn Peruvian woman. :)


Oh man, this is easier said than done. My girlfriend calls me terco all the time, it just makes me laugh!!! Yo???? Eres la terca!
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moving to peru

Postby AnnieRe » Tue Jun 13, 2006 11:48 pm

WOW! reading your story was like I was looking at my life! My husband is Peruvian, and we have been working like crazy here in the US and barely making ends meet. He (after years of pleading) has confienced me to move to Peru. We are leaving in 28 days. I have found a great job there (I am a teacher) and he has some great leads. Even if he does find anything we will be fine on my income. We already have a great apartment in a wonderful location, and a nanny/housekeeper. here we cannot even afford a babysitter! The most important thing for us though, was not living like kings (becuase that is not reality) it is having more time to spend together, and the culture with more focus on family and friends. I am looking forward to it. The big diff. is that my husband is from an upperclass family so his life in Peru was very diff. from your wife's. In the US there are diff. classes, but it is not the same. People there will know that she is from a poor family just by looking at her and talking to her and will often treat her as lower classs. I am sure that it is more the racism that she is afraid of. I would not want to return to a place were I was thought of as a 2nd class citizen or "chola" (sp?) as they say. I feel this is very wrong, and there seems to be a change with the younger people in Peru, but the classism is still very much there. :cry:
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lifestyle...

Postby hoot99 » Wed Jun 14, 2006 3:55 am

you couldn't have said it more perfectly!! (see quote below from previous post) & so we are also departing. the family is less immediate there, but more of a family. the schools help to teach & discipline, rather than workng against the parents in this task. children are real children, for a longer time. do all of you get negative reaction from family here? ours don't understand why we would want to leave good ol usa.

"... For some reason, there seems to be less and less time for family gatherings [in the u.s.] and special dates fade into 'things to do' that swallow one's time. I feel I am living for the house, not in the house, that pulling weeds so the neighbor won't hate crabgrass is just not my cup of tea any longer, and I want to have more time to enjoy what I really want to be doing, not be consumed by what I have to be doing just to stay afloat. ..."
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Re: moving to peru

Postby Allards » Wed Jun 14, 2006 4:51 am

AnnieRe wrote:People there will know that she is from a poor family just by looking at her and talking to her and will often treat her as lower classs. I am sure that it is more the racism that she is afraid of.
That’s true, but i think that the Class you have insight, reflects on the outside. Social status income and life style reflect. I know enough Cholas no one dares to discriminate. But if you still look if you arrived from Puno yesterday wearing pretty clothes for the occasion today unfortunately you will be discriminated.


And sometimes they are simply discriminated because there behaviour show they are low class, if people misbehave it seems normal others respond. It’s not always racism.
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Re: same boat...

Postby Remy » Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:00 am

hoot99 wrote:you haven't mentioned kids - we have 2 little ones - and i have already gone to peru just to find that private schools there actually discipline their kids - along with i.b. educations! to say the least, ... we're outta here!!


That discipline will be gone once they leave school. Discipline is not in the Latin mentality and when the children go to university, they will smell the air of freedom and become like the rest of the people: impatient and ill-mannered.
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What are you thinking??

Postby snt » Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:30 pm

"....All of the people in other countries want what the people in the USA have..."

Um, no. They 'all' don't. I happen to live in Florida as well - I am American. I have travelled extensively (internationally), for both business and pleasure. I have lived for more than a year in France and for 4 years in the UK. My husband is British.

I have found people to love Americans for their positive nature, the can-do-anything attitude, the confidence in tackling new challenges...which we learn as children at an early age. Many of us are pretty damn fun.

I have found that people (just about everywhere) do NOT love the blunt arrogance of many Americans and the sense that everyone, everywhere, should do as America does. I find that the majority of my past and present colleagues, friends and clients DO NOT want the same things that you say they do. FAMILY is a tremendous priority in many other parts of the world, perhaps more than in America (think about the 'admirable' American work/life balance v. those of other countries).

I hope that your posts were the result of mistaken communication, as you would alienate many international citizens -- and Americans -- with such statements. It is far more rewarding to experience other cultures as as invited guest than as an 'ugly American'.

And, other countries more beautiful? Depends on where you go. I personally think that Miami Beach beats Jo'burg shantytowns, and Franfurt doesn't do as much for me as San Francisco. Then again, I left NYC for Paris, and it is my personal opinion that there is nothing as wonderful as wearing as hand- made Peruvian sweater. I'd like to think that I can find beauty and appreciate the best that each culture has to offer -- with an attitude that is not offending to anyone.

As someone who followed her dream and lived abroad, trust me -- a little humility goes a long way.
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neat

Postby z28com » Tue Jun 20, 2006 10:57 pm

TRUE DAT!!!
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well said

Postby hoot99 » Wed Jun 21, 2006 9:50 am

well said - having lived abroad - south & far east countries - arrogant americans are disliked everywhere, as are arrogant parisians, arrogant spaniards, etc...

i don't think anyone was being arrogant though on this forum, as it is true that this country is where the majority want to be (lets face it, people are running from their countries)

but it is a valid reminder, that we should live abroad with the greatest respect & acceptance of other countries & their traditions, just as we expect of them here!
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Postby AnnieRe » Wed Jun 21, 2006 10:53 am

Well said Hoot
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house

Postby z28com » Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:18 pm

There hasn't been a day go by since I first started posting on here that I want to move to Peru. My wife keeps telling me that if we move there, we'll never have the house and new cars that we have now. She is SPOILED ROTTEN NOW! When I first met her, she did not care about all of this stuff. I was born in the USA and I'm ready to give it all up to move to a country with nicer people that don't have the bad attitude!

These material things are nice, but sometimes it just isn't worth being a slave 60 hours per week to keep them.
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Postby gypsy » Mon Jun 26, 2006 10:20 am

Well, material things are nice, especially if you have not had the luxury before. My story is kind of backwards, since I lacked nothing while growing up in my parents' home in Lima, and contrary to others who came here to live better, I ended up, figuratively speaking, abandoning the crown for the orchard. I have not minded hard work, but it has been at least a decade since I have come to resent most material things. These same things we lust for when we do not have them end up being our masters--more things to tend to, to take care of, to worry about, to take our hard-earned money for repairing, maintining, guarding. I am looking forward to simplicity, no car or car insurance, no AC or sprinkler system, no pool pump or cracking walls, no weeds or flying shingles. It does not matter to me if I have holes in my underwear or if my walls do not have the latest fad of texture. I have come to more than strongly resent most material objects peering at me calling my attention. Things are supposed to make our lives easier, not demand all of our time and effort. It is a nightmare how we have accumulated, and rather eye-opening how we need NOT most of what we have. Abundance translates to waste and discomfort, to preoccupation about things, leaving little if any time for friends and family, let alone for time for ourselves. I look forward to the pedicurist who has the time to come to my house and the friend who can get away to reminisce over a cup of tea. I look forward to the slow carpenter who earns his wages per hour of labor and does not rush to get to the next job, and to befriending him and maybe even make of him my friend and associate.
Oops, interruptions--buzzers, honks, hollers, strange sounds of falling objects, soon to mow the lawn and make sure I do not miss garbage day... I look forward to being able to pay for someone to earn a living while he or she helps to alleviate my load..

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...

Postby z28com » Mon Jun 26, 2006 10:51 am

Well said!

Amen to that!!
Guest

Postby Guest » Fri Mar 14, 2008 9:31 pm

WOW ON This,,, sorry I am brining something from 2006 Up But Weird look at this How times have changed bad,, Now going down to maybe 2.40 before May.. Sorry To Remy I am rehashing this from before Yeh 2006,, I am not trolling But this is Crazy How Far it has gone.. And especially in such a short time,, Thats like Funny in A Bad way... So Now with The WorldWide Inflation/Stagflation this is funny How The infalation is hitting Peru.. The dollar to in to Free Fall 1.56 to the Euro.. I here it will even plunge more and more,, Yeh within the next two years absolute worldwide depression,, So Weird How its going from The USA Dollar falling,,, Incedible on The Way THE Dollar went Awol IN PERU,, Happy.
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Nuevo Sole

Postby z28com » Sat Mar 15, 2008 9:07 am

If that's the case, then I cannot move there as my income would be coming from the US.

US Click here to see Dollar to Nuevo Sole

At the time of this writing, I would normally be able to live on 5,600 Nuevo Soles per month after converting my income. Let's see what that would drop down to in May.
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Re: Nuevo Sole

Postby Guest » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:29 am

WOW MAN Even 2.81 Is Bad But if it gets to 2.40 or something like That then its impossible What Harrassers Like Nature Girl And Mamalulu do not know some people like Me live on Fixed Incomes And What The USA Government is doing Wrong,, Then I Get Nabbed For talking about the falling dollar I am a Troll,, Lets Keep getting this dollar discusiion going cause going to 2.40 will make Peru A Little expensive for ME and YOU..
z28com wrote:If that's the case, then I cannot move there as my income would be coming from the US.

US Click here to see Dollar to Nuevo Sole

At the time of this writing, I would normally be able to live on 5,600 Nuevo Soles per month after converting my income. Let's see what that would drop down to in May.
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Re: man...

Postby Guest » Sat Mar 15, 2008 11:14 am

HEY Z with even 2000 A Month for both of you even if i9t goes to 2.40 is cool,, I Mean You probably will not be able to get a house though but a Fine Apartment.. How do You end up getting 2000 a month??? an EX Job?? Construction?? Usually People getting some kind of help on that in The USA get anwhere from like a few 100 to a 1000 But You get 2000 A month??? WOW Even with The Falling Dollar you can do that for sure,, Now I understand your situation To ME I can probably still do it even on 2.40 But the reason I was Also living in Peru because it was so damn cheap if I must have things higher I will go to a slightly higher place Like Costa Or THe Dr Where Things are more modern and enjoy.. Hope You and others understand what I mean on this but in the end the dollar should be pegged 3 to 1 in Peru,, Sincerly Happy,, Yes Keep in touch Z....
z28com wrote:My wife just read your reply and she literally punched me in the face telling me that we're only going to visit and not move. I've been trying to convince her how well off we'd be living there. Sometimes my checks are good and I could have up to $11,000 Sol's in a month!

She's waiting for her papers here to be complete so she can be a permanent resident in the US and then she wants to sponsor her family who live here now.

The problem living here in the US is that when I make $2000 USD per month, our bills are like $4,000. Moving to Lima, you get to enjoy the wealth of the currency conversion. It's like people moving from Europe to the US. They get more money for their Euro since the Euro is worth much more than the USD.

Hopefully we'll get some money saved and then we will be able to take a trip down there to visit.

I've been looking at the prices of used cars on here. One person wanted $1,000 for some old '74 Toyota. Are they insane? I bought one of those here, 10 years ago, for $150 bucks!

How much is a brand new car from the dealer in Lima?
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Re: man...

Postby z28com » Sat Mar 15, 2008 4:59 pm

happyreturns wrote:HEY Z with even 2000 A Month for both of you even if i9t goes to 2.40 is cool,, I Mean You probably will not be able to get a house though but a Fine Apartment.. How do You end up getting 2000 a month??? an EX Job?? Construction?? Usually People getting some kind of help on that in The USA get anwhere from like a few 100 to a 1000 But You get 2000 A month??? WOW Even with The Falling Dollar you can do that for sure,, Now I understand your situation To ME I can probably still do it even on 2.40 But the reason I was Also living in Peru because it was so damn cheap if I must have things higher I will go to a slightly higher place Like Costa Or THe Dr Where Things are more modern and enjoy.. Hope You and others understand what I mean on this but in the end the dollar should be pegged 3 to 1 in Peru,, Sincerly Happy,, Yes Keep in touch Z....


No, I got involved in an on-line Internet business a few years back and now I have so many clients buying on-line where I earn commissions, I get a steady flow of checks. They are not enough to live here, but in Peru, I could be a king... I would guess? I actually make anywhere between $2,000 and $3,800, but 1/3rd of that goes right to the IRS, so I usually average a net of about $2,000. Me and my wife were both working full time jobs and now have lost them, so the $2,000 net is all we have to live on which is about 1/3rd to 1/2 of what we need to pay all of our bills here for our home, credit cards and cars.

I've been BEGGING my wife to move back. Every single day I beg her to move there, she just rolls her eyes at me and says no. Then she calls her mom and her mom tells me that I am nuts.

I don't know if I posted on here yet... but I did finally get a chance to see Lima! I LOVED IT!! I was actually in Pueblo Libre if any of you know where that is. We ate dinner in Miraflores. Man, the food there is sooooooooooooooooooooooo cheap!!!

When I went to an ATM to get Nuevo Soles, my ATM balance at the time was 16,000.00 Nuevo Soles!!!! That was the balance right after pay day. Man, that was so sweet.

I remember going to a nice ice cream shop in downtown Lima and me and 4 others had nice ice creams. It was only $3.50 USD. The same here at a place like Coldstone Ice Cream would have costed over $25 USD!

The only thing that I didn't like is the MAJOR pollution and lack of stop signs. I didn't see a single cop giving anyone a ticket. They acted as if they didn't care.

All of the people were really nice there. I can tell you, I would much rather live there and give up a lot of my material possessions here. I also lost about 10 pounds while being there from all of the required walking.

I will have to see about posting pictures of where we stayed. I took a ton of pictures. Maybe for those of you who are down there will recognize many of the areas.

I can also say I would NEVER want to have a new car down there. Man, most every car I saw was banged up. I thought that was weird how you can't pump your own gas. Every place we went to had an attendant. Doesn't that jack up the price? Why isn't it self-serve using gas card or Visa debit card?

Even with all of the pro's and con's, I would rather be down there in the city with no car having $4,000 to $6,000 Nuevo Soles per month (after taxes). I saw several apartments in Miraflores and they are the same price as in the US, so I see no advantage there. If these people see that you're a North American, they appear to rob you blind. This is why I would want to be with my wife so she could do most of the talking and start bawking at people when they try to overcharge us for stuff.

What do you think a typical break-down of cost of living would be if I ate out almost every day for breakfast, lunch and dinner (being that it's so cheap)?

Here's an example of my current cost of living in the US... please post your break-downs of your real cost of living in Nuevo Soles:

My current in USD:
Mortgage, taxes & insurance: $1100 (for a 3 bedroom house w/ 2 car garage)
Two car payments $1000
Car insurance: $100
Electric: $120
Food: $300
Credit cards: $250
Internet: $60 (10 MB downloads and 1 MB uploads)
Gas: Currently $3.60/gallon for premium and $3.30 for regular. We go through about a tank per week or so in each... maybe $200/mo. or so.
Cell phones: $200 (getting ready to be shut off)
Home phone: $30
Water: $0 (free since we get it from a well)

There's a ton of other small bills. There's way too many transactions on my banking info to summarize. I want to see how all of this would change if I actually lived down there on a similar lifestyle. I don't eat out at 3x per day because it's so expensive here, but if I lived down there, I would. All of the above is currently above our present income since we are now both unemployed. This is also making me just want to pack up a suit case and bail down there. But the last time I was there, they stamped "30 days" on my passport. How do I get it to say "1 year" instead? Or is that not possible?
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Re: Nuevo Sole

Postby z28com » Sat Mar 15, 2008 5:03 pm

happyreturns wrote:WOW MAN Even 2.81 Is Bad But if it gets to 2.40 or something like That then its impossible What Harrassers Like Nature Girl And Mamalulu do not know some people like Me live on Fixed Incomes And What The USA Government is doing Wrong,, Then I Get Nabbed For talking about the falling dollar I am a Troll,, Lets Keep getting this dollar discusiion going cause going to 2.40 will make Peru A Little expensive for ME and YOU..


Yes, sir... that is the exact same thing that scares me now from relocating there as my income would also be fixed as well. I can't have 1/3rd to 1/2 of my income magically disappear all because of a currency flux. That's a rip off. Then again, I can't afford to live in this country on what I earn with the same fixed income. If it ever goes to a 1:1 ratio, I would have to flee to Europe.

Also, I don't see why you'd be a troll. What I wish I could do is get the same income I have now, but get it to come from Europe so that way I can convert the Euro to the dollar and THEN I could double or triple my money!
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Re: man...

Postby naturegirl » Sat Mar 15, 2008 5:49 pm

z28com wrote:What do you think a typical break-down of cost of living would be if I ate out almost every day for breakfast, lunch and dinner (being that it's so cheap)?

Mortgage, taxes & insurance: $1100 (for a 3 bedroom house w/ 2 car garage)
Two car payments $1000
Car insurance: $100
Electric: $120
Food: $300
Credit cards: $250
Internet: $60 (10 MB downloads and 1 MB uploads)
Gas: Currently $3.60/gallon for premium and $3.30 for regular. We go through about a tank per week or so in each... maybe $200/mo. or so.
Cell phones: $200 (getting ready to be shut off)
Home phone: $30
Water: $0 (free since we get it from a well)
But the last time I was there, they stamped "30 days" on my passport. How do I get it to say "1 year" instead? Or is that not possible?


If you ate out every day, it would cost beteen 5 and 10 soles a meal, but you could arrange a cheaper price if you ate at the same restaurante. here's more or less our budget.

Mortgage: Zero, we own our flat.
Insurance¨: 100 soles, work covers half
Lunch: 200 soles
TransportÑ 150 soles for two people.
Electric: 50 soles
Food: 300 soles
Credit cards: Zero
Internet and phone 180 soles
Water 50 soles
Spending money: 140 soles
Cell: 60 soles

You can usually get 90 days stamped on your passport, and you can renew it 3 times, for 30 days each, then you have to leave the ocuntry. Read The ultimate Peru List for more info about visas, living here, etc.
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Re: Nuevo Sole

Postby rgamarra » Sat Mar 15, 2008 6:48 pm

z28com wrote:Yes, sir... that is the exact same thing that scares me now from relocating there as my income would also be fixed as well. I can't have 1/3rd to 1/2 of my income magically disappear all because of a currency flux. That's a rip off. Then again, I can't afford to live in this country on what I earn with the same fixed income. If it ever goes to a 1:1 ratio, I would have to flee to Europe.

Also, I don't see why you'd be a troll. What I wish I could do is get the same income I have now, but get it to come from Europe so that way I can convert the Euro to the dollar and THEN I could double or triple my money!


You should convert your Euros to Soles and get 4+X the value. :idea:
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Re: man...

Postby z28com » Sat Mar 15, 2008 6:53 pm

naturegirl wrote:If you ate out every day, it would cost beteen 5 and 10 soles a meal, but you could arrange a cheaper price if you ate at the same restaurante. here's more or less our budget.

Mortgage: Zero, we own our flat.
Insurance¨: 100 soles, work covers half
Lunch: 200 soles
TransportÑ 150 soles for two people.
Electric: 50 soles
Food: 300 soles
Credit cards: Zero
Internet and phone 180 soles
Water 50 soles
Spending money: 140 soles
Cell: 60 soles

You can usually get 90 days stamped on your passport, and you can renew it 3 times, for 30 days each, then you have to leave the ocuntry. Read The ultimate Peru List for more info about visas, living here, etc.


O.M.G. that is sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo cheap!!! I WOULD BE RICH if I lived there!!
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Cost of living

Postby Dan Bonenberger » Sat Mar 15, 2008 7:06 pm

Hi Friend, Looking at Nature Girls figures makes it look quite enticing to live in Lima, BBBBBBUUUUTTTT monitoring Nature Girl for some time she is a veteran , She knows how to bargain and knows how to find them.... If I was an owner of a large business. I would hire her to manage the books . She is missing her true calling. Like CFO of a company. Go get your MBA nature girl and make some real money. What do you think Expats. Take Care Dan..
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