Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

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chi chi
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Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:53 pm

After being in Peru for 5 years, I am thinking of leaving. I lived in several countries before coming to Peru and the 5 years in Peru has been the longest period in any country I have spendet outside my homecountry.

Often life gets bored if you stay in the same place for a long time and I would like to have a job. Jobopportunities in Peru are scarce and if you find a job the wage and workconditions are marginal.
I also think that my gf works too many hours and her wage is so so.
I think she will have much better work conditions in Europe and more security too. Pensions and wellfare will be better for her in case she loses her job.

The UK, Ireland and Belgium are our options. A bit more colder and rainy but it has it charms too. The UK and Ireland are beautifull. Nice friendly people and a good standard of living.

Anyone else is thinking of ''bailing out''?


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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby teamoperu » Thu Jul 24, 2014 5:22 am

So no luck with your job interviews in LA?
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby Bobby » Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:10 am

Just got a baby and when I add up costs for a good education, costs for a health system, increasing inflation on food and hobbies, and a degrading social and political climate I realize that the trade-off of living in Peru is certainly not the best for us at the moment (this wasn´t the case 10 years ago).
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:10 am

teamoperu wrote:So no luck with your job interviews in LA?


I decided not to go at the end. The chance of getting a job with them is too small. It will have costed a lot of money as well to go to the interviews. I am now making plans to go to Europe. The UK, Ireland and Belgium are on the list. A plus is that I won't have to worry about work visas there.

I am a bit worried about my health as well so healthcare is better there too.

Bobby wrote:Just got a baby and when I add up costs for a good education, costs for a health system, increasing inflation on food and hobbies, and a degrading social and political climate I realize that the trade-off of living in Peru is certainly not the best for us at the moment (this wasn´t the case 10 years ago).


Sure, prices are going up quickly. As long as you have enough income then life can be comfortable enough. But if things go wrong, there's no help from the government at all.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby teamoperu » Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:12 am

chi chi wrote:
teamoperu wrote:So no luck with your job interviews in LA?


I decided not to go at the end. The chance of getting a job with them is too small. It will have costed a lot of money as well to go to the interviews. I am now making plans to go to Europe. The UK, Ireland and Belgium are on the list. A plus is that I won't have to worry about work visas there.

I am a bit worried about my health as well so healthcare is better there too.

Bobby wrote:Just got a baby and when I add up costs for a good education, costs for a health system, increasing inflation on food and hobbies, and a degrading social and political climate I realize that the trade-off of living in Peru is certainly not the best for us at the moment (this wasn´t the case 10 years ago).


Sure, prices are going up quickly. As long as you have enough income then life can be comfortable enough. But if things go wrong, there's no help from the government at all.


"I decided not to go at the end. The chance of getting a job with them is too small."

Oh. That was exactly what I said when you announced how hard you are looking for job on the other thread. You disagreed, but now you agree with me. Good.

In the thread where you announced how hard you were looking for a job, you wrote “Soon, I will be going to LA to 2 open days of airlines.” “My gf is going as well. In between the 2 recruitment events, we go to Las Vegas for a few days. We found a good rate at expedia.com to stay at the Flamingo.” and “The Emirates recruitment event in LA is by invitation only. I applied to them and got an invitation.”

I then suggested that you knew you had no chance of getting a job with them. You replied “Thanks for this post teamoperu. You are almost putting me off to go to the open days. I allready booked my flight so I guess I better hop straight on the Greyhound bus to Las Vegas after arriving in LA and skip the interview. And keep living of wellfare of course.”

You already booked your flight? Your gf arranged time off? And you cancelled all at the last minute losing your interview, your air fare and holiday at the Flamingo? Something sure smells fishy.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:42 am

teamoperu wrote:
chi chi wrote:
teamoperu wrote:So no luck with your job interviews in LA?


I decided not to go at the end. The chance of getting a job with them is too small. It will have costed a lot of money as well to go to the interviews. I am now making plans to go to Europe. The UK, Ireland and Belgium are on the list. A plus is that I won't have to worry about work visas there.

I am a bit worried about my health as well so healthcare is better there too.

Bobby wrote:Just got a baby and when I add up costs for a good education, costs for a health system, increasing inflation on food and hobbies, and a degrading social and political climate I realize that the trade-off of living in Peru is certainly not the best for us at the moment (this wasn´t the case 10 years ago).


Sure, prices are going up quickly. As long as you have enough income then life can be comfortable enough. But if things go wrong, there's no help from the government at all.


"I decided not to go at the end. The chance of getting a job with them is too small."

Oh. That was exactly what I said when you announced how hard you are looking for job on the other thread. You disagreed, but now you agree with me. Good.

You already booked your flight? Your gf arranged time off? And you cancelled all at the last minute losing your interview, your air fare and holiday at the Flamingo? Something sure smells fishy.


Nothing fishy. I am just trying to increase my chances of getting a job and my gf isn't too keen on moving to the Middle East. Europe will be better for her.

The airfare isn't lost. They didn't refund the money but the gave a voucher that I can use to travel in the future. I can use it to fly to Europe now.

With my previous airline experience, I would have had a good (but indeed small) chance but after some thoughts I prefer to go to Europe for several reasons. I am now applying to airlines in the UK and in talks with an airline I worked for before. I am considering ground positions as well. I hope I will find something soon. If not, I will attend a training course for a job where's there's a shortage of qualified people. As I have been unemployed for some time so I can get free training courses.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby teamoperu » Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:07 pm

Well, wishing you luck.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:14 pm

teamoperu wrote:Well, wishing you luck.


Thanks a million.

I probably leave in September. In September, students go back to university so employers can avail less of them so they will have to employ people that cost a bit more.



Is there anyone else thinking of leaving permanently or temporarely?
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:48 pm

I wouldn't mind going back, It's just too difficult trying to get the same quality of life as that back home. This makes you ask what is the point of being here.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby Danny55 » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:25 am

In about 5 years time I may well be looking to move on from Peru. One major consideration is Education for my daughter. It is not just the cost here, but the transport which is an issue - as a kid I always walked to school, was far safer.
However, should things improve here greater (unlikely) we may decide that staying makes sense.

As Chi Chi points out Peru is not the place to come find a job, however there are plenty of opportunities to set your own business up, the cost of failure is a lot lower here than in Europe for example.

Nowhere in the world is perfect, everywhere has it's faults, you just have to focus on the plus points else you will drive yourself crazy :)
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby TShadow » Sat Jul 26, 2014 12:20 pm

In two years living here I've seen already the death of 6 friends/family members for various reasons like bad health care, one died recently because she had no health insurance and no money to get help in a hospital. I wrote about this case in my Forum which is in German language. Other 2 got assaulted and killed.

I also don't like the political direction where Peru is actually heading. I believe it's not anymore a place where to get old. So if I can get my matters together, I hope I can leave.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Sat Jul 26, 2014 12:37 pm

TShadow wrote:I also don't like the political direction where Peru is actually heading. I believe it's not anymore a place where to get old. So if I can get my matters together, I hope I can leave.


I think for people that have kids, they are better of in Europe. Free and good education, child support and free healthcare.

If you get old, you might just get a lousy pension. (if you are even lucky to get a pension)

One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future. She has a good job now but work conditions and pay is much better in Europe and she will have to work less hours. She will be guaranteed a good pension in the future and in the case she loses her job, she will get help from the government. She can attend a training course or study without any cost at all.

Education and training courses are expensive in Peru and still the quality is often low.

You can live well in Peru if you arrive with money. But making enough money to get a decent lifestyle is tough. Many try but few succeed. And the ones that succeed have to work too much for it and take too many risks.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby adrian Thorne » Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:00 pm

chi chi wrote:
TShadow wrote:I also don't like the political direction where Peru is actually heading. I believe it's not anymore a place where to get old. So if I can get my matters together, I hope I can leave.


I think for people that have kids, they are better of in Europe. Free and good education, child support and free healthcare.

If you get old, you might just get a lousy pension. (if you are even lucky to get a pension)

One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future. She has a good job now but work conditions and pay is much better in Europe and she will have to work less hours. She will be guaranteed a good pension in the future and in the case she loses her job, she will get help from the government. She can attend a training course or study without any cost at all.

Education and training courses are expensive in Peru and still the quality is often low.

You can live well in Peru if you arrive with money. But making enough money to get a decent lifestyle is tough. Many try but few succeed. And the ones that succeed have to work too much for it and take too many risks.



Chi Chi I cannot for the life of me understand your beliefs.

During my working career in the Uk there is two deductions taken from my salary and this applies to all people who work there.
I have not checked lately, but I think it is still the same percentage I paid and I still pay after seven years retirement .

32% income tax, which reduced to 23% on incomes below 24,000 pounds per annum and 7% National health insurance.
This makes me think the national health service is not free as you suggest
A proportion of the tax and council taxes are paid to the schools and I am fully aware that my monthly rates bill paid in the UK is approximately the same as my annual rates bill in Peru.

I have no heating costs,which means a combined monthly electricity and gas bill of 200 soles, a quarter of what I paid in the uk, live in a home three times the size of my semi. in the UK and own a car purchased new.

Utilities in the UK have increased in price by over 50% in the last seven years and here in Peru they have been unchanged.

I agree basic food is the same price, but better quality food is in fact cheaper and the beer / Cigs are a fraction of the cost.

I have two brothers who worked all there lives. Now in their fifties they are both unemployed and struggling on social security to maintain their homes and family.

I think I will stay here in Peru, enjoy the life and chatting with the people who work in and around my home.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby TShadow » Sat Jul 26, 2014 6:47 pm

We all see things with different eyes. That's fine, thus it should be. My daughters cousin immigrated some years ago to London and she is doing great there. She's not even thinking of going back.

In Italy my tax payments were more than 50% of my earnings, health care is not free if you're working on your own, you have to pay a fee, but hospital care and many medicines are still free, and generally speaking quality of life for me in Germany and Italy is better than in Peru. It's true that you might live better here if with your $1000 Pension than in Europe, you also might be better living if you earn $1000 in a month here, but definitely you are better off in most European countries if you have kids, health problems, etc.

In my Expat Forum 90% of members would go back if they weren't here because of marriage with a Peruvian, and all of the couples who have to pay for the education of their kids are having a miserable life working only to pay bills. I also thought that when I worked in Italy that I'm working only to pay bills, but it's the same story here and for my girlfriend too. She also is paying nearly $200 a month for her health insurance which service does not even come close to Germany or Italy.

I mean it all depends how you're seeing life and it's also about your health. I'm still lucky, I don't even know what a medicine is, but this could change any day.

Very often it's also only a question of money. Let's keep the song in mind 'Life is life (nanananana)'.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:06 am

adrian Thorne wrote:Chi Chi I cannot for the life of me understand your beliefs.

During my working career in the Uk there is two deductions taken from my salary and this applies to all people who work there.
I have not checked lately, but I think it is still the same percentage I paid and I still pay after seven years retirement .

32% income tax, which reduced to 23% on incomes below 24,000 pounds per annum and 7% National health insurance.
This makes me think the national health service is not free as you suggest
A proportion of the tax and council taxes are paid to the schools and I am fully aware that my monthly rates bill paid in the UK is approximately the same as my annual rates bill in Peru.


Adrian, in Peru, people also get deductions on their wage. But what do they get for it? Right, nothing.
Years ago, when my gf her mother got cáncer. She had to cease going to university, get a job and pay for her mothers medical bills. This would have never happened in Europe. Sure, we pay high taxes in Europe but we get excellent education and first class healthcare for it.

In the UK and many other EU countries, if you are on a low income you get council housing or rent allowance. In Peru, you end up in a shed on the hills around Lima without electricity or running wáter.

adrian Thorne wrote:I think I will stay here in Peru, enjoy the life and chatting with the people who work in and around my home.


Sure, you have a good life here because you made your money in the UK and got a pension from the UK. But you wouldn't have the same lifestyle if you have to live of a 150 soles a month Peruvian pension.

adrian Thorne wrote:I have two brothers who worked all there lives. Now in their fifties they are both unemployed and struggling on social security to maintain their homes and family.


Being on the dole in the UK is still far better than being on the dole in Peru.

Adrian, if your brothers are really struggling, tell them to check out the wellfare system in Belgium. As they are EU citizens, they are entitled to claim benefits in Belgium. Unemployment benefits are much better in Belgium than in the UK. In the UK, it's only 72 quid a week. In Belgium, they easily get 3 times more. They have to get a E301 form from their local DSS office and they can claim benefits in Belgium.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby teamoperu » Sun Jul 27, 2014 6:08 am

chi chi wrote:
TShadow wrote:I also don't like the political direction where Peru is actually heading. I believe it's not anymore a place where to get old. So if I can get my matters together, I hope I can leave.


I think for people that have kids, they are better of in Europe. Free and good education, child support and free healthcare.

If you get old, you might just get a lousy pension. (if you are even lucky to get a pension)

One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future. She has a good job now but work conditions and pay is much better in Europe and she will have to work less hours. She will be guaranteed a good pension in the future and in the case she loses her job, she will get help from the government. She can attend a training course or study without any cost at all.

Education and training courses are expensive in Peru and still the quality is often low.

You can live well in Peru if you arrive with money. But making enough money to get a decent lifestyle is tough. Many try but few succeed. And the ones that succeed have to work too much for it and take too many risks.


OK, to summarize. You live a very good life (as per your posts) in Peru on Belgium welfare (by defrauding it by “forgetting” to tell them you live in Peru). You don't work, go to Internet cafes all the time, go to the beach almost daily and bars for uvachado regularly. You live in a nice house with garden purchased using a Peruvian assistance program for poor people via your gf. Other than watching out for bogeymen, not so bad, no obvious reason to leave. However, your gf works Peruvian job (6 days, 10 hours) for meager wages to support you. Too bad you cannot find another gf to be able to live off 2 gfs working Peruvian jobs. Now you are worried about your gf (yeah, riiiight):

“One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future. She has a good job now but work conditions and pay is much better in Europe and she will have to work less hours. She will be guaranteed a good pension in the future and in the case she loses her job, she will get help from the government. She can attend a training course or study without any cost at all.”

So you want to move her to Europe away from her family where she can earn European wages and get into social assistance and a pension. You have no pension, so yes clearly her having social assistance and a pension is wise. Too bad you can't have 2 gf with social assistance and pensions to live off when you get old. And yes, she can go for free training to earn more $$ for you. Of course, you didn't take those courses to get a job, you do not work, she does. Sweet.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby teamoperu » Sun Jul 27, 2014 10:58 am

Of course she has a say! Remember he wrote: "“One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future." Obviously, he is not providing that.

Maybe even she hopes he will finally get a job there so she isn't the sole worker earning a salary? Two salaries are better than one.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:23 am

adrian Thorne wrote:
chi chi wrote:
TShadow wrote:I also don't like the political direction where Peru is actually heading. I believe it's not anymore a place where to get old. So if I can get my matters together, I hope I can leave.


I think for people that have kids, they are better of in Europe. Free and good education, child support and free healthcare.

If you get old, you might just get a lousy pension. (if you are even lucky to get a pension)

One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future. She has a good job now but work conditions and pay is much better in Europe and she will have to work less hours. She will be guaranteed a good pension in the future and in the case she loses her job, she will get help from the government. She can attend a training course or study without any cost at all.

Education and training courses are expensive in Peru and still the quality is often low.

You can live well in Peru if you arrive with money. But making enough money to get a decent lifestyle is tough. Many try but few succeed. And the ones that succeed have to work too much for it and take too many risks.



Chi Chi I cannot for the life of me understand your beliefs.

During my working career in the Uk there is two deductions taken from my salary and this applies to all people who work there.
I have not checked lately, but I think it is still the same percentage I paid and I still pay after seven years retirement .

32% income tax, which reduced to 23% on incomes below 24,000 pounds per annum and 7% National health insurance.
This makes me think the national health service is not free as you suggest
A proportion of the tax and council taxes are paid to the schools and I am fully aware that my monthly rates bill paid in the UK is approximately the same as my annual rates bill in Peru.

I have no heating costs,which means a combined monthly electricity and gas bill of 200 soles, a quarter of what I paid in the uk, live in a home three times the size of my semi. in the UK and own a car purchased new.

Utilities in the UK have increased in price by over 50% in the last seven years and here in Peru they have been unchanged.

I agree basic food is the same price, but better quality food is in fact cheaper and the beer / Cigs are a fraction of the cost.

I have two brothers who worked all there lives. Now in their fifties they are both unemployed and struggling on social security to maintain their homes and family.

I think I will stay here in Peru, enjoy the life and chatting with the people who work in and around my home.


The difference here is if you come here retired or if you have kids, or travelling because of your job. You get taxed a lot in the UK but it's great what you get in return for those taxes. You have to remember those taxes ensure your brothers social security and there is an extremely big difference between struggling in Britain compared to struggling in Peru so it is swings and round abouts i guess.

Your paying taxes for your safety net and IMHO it's worth every penny. I know taxes are cheaper here but you live in a country where no one cares about the poor, every western country would have cheaper taxes if they didn't care about the poor. You don't have huge class divides and a slave labour work force who you can treat like total scum of the earth because of equality brought by those taxes. You don't need to have 10 foot high security walls and security guards to prevent crime as people aren't reduced to stealing to get by.

The heating bills have definitely gone up but i never understand why people have to heat every single room in a house with central heating, then walk around the house in a T-shirt and shorts and who then say oh the bills are high!! No s*** Einstein! These bills can easily be reduced and you don't need that much heating, i grew up in a old house with just coal fires and none of my grandparents died from it, i would say just changing to that could knock 75% off your electric bill right there. Petrol is a different matter that's a hammer to the budget purse but again you can trade in the larger car for a smaller more economic one.

I'm married but i just have to give up on the idea of kids, i just can't afford it here. The private school bills, health care, then university fees it's not worth it! My brother in law pays $1500 a month for his 4 kids education. That's already $1500 a month you wouldn't have to pay in the UK.if you had a family the same size. You most definitely wouldn't send your kids to a Peruvian state school or state hospital would you. Which as mention if you have kids, yes living here is harder!

The tax also provides public transport system, what i would give for proper public transport kn Peru instead of those killing machines on wheels! And trains! Clean streets, a proper police force instead of an army of traffic wardens, the list is endless. Sorry but i'm with chichi on this one and he's talking a lot of sense, it's the reason why illegal immigrants head to the UK instead of staying in France or other countries.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:32 am

teamoperu wrote:Of course she has a say! Remember he wrote: "“One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future." Obviously, he is not providing that.

Maybe even she hopes he will finally get a job there so she isn't the sole worker earning a salary? Two salaries are better than one.


If chichi receives benefits wouldn't that be a second income tho? And depending on her job it wouldn't surprise me if the benefits were the main source of income if they are living in Tarapoto?

Stability would also mean long term plans like pensions, childs education and chances or progress. You can get this in Peru if you are somewhere like Lima, but even then you need to be bringing in some money if you are looking for a decent education of a child here. Same with a pensions, i can't see the banks giving you a good rate here as they are nothing more than street robbers in a suit!
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby ironchefchris » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:17 pm

Be careful. In that recent wildly popular thread started by the guy who was supposedly from Australia (or San Miguel as someone suggested) and was supposedly looking to bring a Peruvian girl back to Australia, it was suggested that not only do Peruvian girls not like guys who drink, but that a decent and respectable Peruvian girl isn't going to just move abroad away from family and not without being married. It was also suggested that they'll use you to pay for their visa and once they get to Europe they'll dump you, perhaps for a more ambitious man who has more to offer than what being on the dole can provide and/or a latino man because "latinas prefer men from their own culture." This same person cautions that once a Peruvian girl is in Europe she'll become more "Westernized," materialistic, and expect better treatment. You might want to go back to that thread and read some of the advice given to the so called Aussie.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby teamoperu » Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:24 pm

Inside Source wrote:
teamoperu wrote:Of course she has a say! Remember he wrote: "“One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future." Obviously, he is not providing that.

Maybe even she hopes he will finally get a job there so she isn't the sole worker earning a salary? Two salaries are better than one.



He uses the word more so it follows he is already providing stability and security. Just wants opportunity to provide even more.


If he feel he needs to give her more, then he is not giving her enough.... security, that is. :D
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:38 pm

Apart from the odd few rich families, i doubt you will ever have security in Peru. The exception also of western retirees.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:19 pm

teamoperu wrote:Of course she has a say! Remember he wrote: "“One of the reasons I want to leave, is to get my gf more stability and more security for the future." Obviously, he is not providing that.

Maybe even she hopes he will finally get a job there so she isn't the sole worker earning a salary? Two salaries are better than one.


It's not only my decisión. We have been talking about the options together. We travelled together to Europe so she knows how things are in Europe. I had to convince her of the benefits she will get if she spends some time in Europe.
She doesn't live with me because she wants money. She has her own income. She's not an empty headed brichera from La Calle de las Pizzas.

Sure, two salaries are better than one. But the amount off my wellfare benefits won't change a lot if she works.

teamoperu wrote:So you want to move her to Europe away from her family where she can earn European wages and get into social assistance and a pension. You have no pension, so yes clearly her having social assistance and a pension is wise.


I will have a pension as well. Everybody gets a pension in Belgium. Even if you never worked in your life.

ironchefchris wrote:Be careful. In that recent wildly popular thread started by the guy who was supposedly from Australia (or San Miguel as someone suggested) and was supposedly looking to bring a Peruvian girl back to Australia, it was suggested that not only do Peruvian girls not like guys who drink, but that a decent and respectable Peruvian girl isn't going to just move abroad away from family and not without being married. It was also suggested that they'll use you to pay for their visa and once they get to Europe they'll dump you, perhaps for a more ambitious man who has more to offer than what being on the dole can provide and/or a latino man because "latinas prefer men from their own culture." This same person cautions that once a Peruvian girl is in Europe she'll become more "Westernized," materialistic, and expect better treatment. You might want to go back to that thread and read some of the advice given to the so called Aussie.


I have been with my gf for more than 5 years and as I speak Spanish well, I understand her.

The Aussie (who doesn't speak Spanish at all) his intention was to come to Peru for a few weeks, hang out drinking and partying in bars in Miraflores, pick up a ''genuine decent English speaking girl'' and then take her to Australia with him.
(He probably would have ended up in the famous Pizza Street because many of the girls that hang around there speak some English. It helps them with communicating and having more success with their ''customers'' or better called ''bait''.


teamoperu,do you think it would smart to do that?
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby teamoperu » Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:23 am

Not sure I understand the question. Maybe you mean ironchef? If you mean about Pizza Alley, then I defer to your extensive experience there – you are surely THE expert on bricheras and sex tourism at Parque Kennedy. I am still wondering how it is you know so much about it and are an expert at identifying hard to identify transsexuals? (An off topic wonder: do great looking and hard to identify transsexuals use the the mens or the womens public washrooms?)

I am fascinated that the entire decision making process exhibited here is based on how much social assistance is available. “I had to convince her of the benefits she will get if she spends some time in Europe.” “the amount off my wellfare benefits won't change a lot if she works.” “She will be guaranteed a good pension in the future and in the case she loses her job, she will get help from the government. She can attend a training course or study without any cost at all.” I am sure these are valid considerations, but I find the over-riding importance placed on them, well, fascinating. Shopping the world for social assistance and free benefits is a foreign concept to me. "... ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country." John F. Kennedy
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Mon Jul 28, 2014 11:08 am

It's none of my business but chichi i'm guessing you must have paid extra taxes while working as part of a extra security net program incase of injury or long term unemplohment? They have this in the UK (or use to) when you pay extra insurance and receive a higher state handout which only lasts for the amount you paid into it has been totally used up.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby adrian Thorne » Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:08 pm

I Quote:

400 dollars a month for two people
by euroman » Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:00 pm
GUYS,

WE PAY 200 DOLLARS A MONTH FOR MY 2 BED RENTAL FLAT
WE SPEND ABOUT 150 A MONTH ON GROCERIES
AND WE PAY ABOUT 20 DOLLARS A MONTH FOR WATER AND ELECTRICITY
WE SPEND 15 DOLLARS A MONTH ON TRANSPORT

WE ARE NOT RICH BUT HAPPY. I NEVER GOING BACK TO EUROPE
I AM WORKING 20 HOURS A WEEK. I COULDN´T SEE MYSELF WORKING 50 HOURS A WEEK LIKE AND IDIOT IN EUROPE JUST TO MAKE ENDS MEET.

VIVA LA PERU


WHEREVER YOU ARE FROM
by euroman » Fri Oct 16, 2009 2:12 pm
Guys,
wherever part of the world you are from. Are you intending to stay in Peru or ever going back to your country.

I am staying here. I have my own (very small) business.
I dont make a lot of money but just enough to live but I am happy here.
In Europe, I had a lot of stress and just working to pay the bills.
I also think that it would be too difficult for my wife to live in Europe
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:13 pm

Without going into chichi's own personal reasons for returning back to Europe you do have to look at some points about peoples personal long term security when you live in Peru. Things that as retirees you will never have to deal with as you keep getting your pension cheques from back home.

I've heard some horror stories from in-laws like how everyone had savings in dollars and then how Garcia said "no, no you can't have savings in dollars, it has to be in soles and you can't exchange it using a bank you have to use the governement exchange rate only!" He then totally ripped everyone off and exchanged their savings for only a 3rd of the value.

Another person had a high up job in one of the banks and she has some decent stories too, it's just amazing how banks here can treat people like dirt and take their money. Would you put your retirement or life savings in the hands of a Peruvian bank or government? I wouldn't!

You could have a boom bust situation at any point in latin america where you could lose everything you've worked your entire life for and this are what some of the stories are that you hear off in-laws. You just need to look at Perus economic history as well, periods of boom with natural resource exports but then they never invest in other forms of industry and then bang, their bust again! Currently i'm not seeing investment in other industry so guess what, yep history will repeat itself again probably, and when it does what's going to happen to the value of everyones savings in soles? But on he plus side everything will be cheaper for the retirees with their American dollar who will be living an even better quality of life.

The quality of life in Peru varies on your situation, it is a good life for those with qualifications and business in exploiting natural resources, retirees, anything where your on a foreign wage. Apart from the rich and a few others the remaining 80% of people in Lima are really going to have a lot lower quality of life with no sure ways of pension or support other than the tradional retirement plan of have as many children as possible to support you in old age!

Just from reading the article chichi posted on a house for £1.70 nwhere it stated the couple were paying £450 for rent with bills included, which for anything past the watford gap was a pretty decent comparision for bills and rent for low quality life in the UK, you would still have if a single person on minimum wage of £990 ($1700) a month be left with £540 ($900). How many people in Lima get $1700 a month or even $900 at that! Everyting is almost the same price too once you've taken out rent and electric and council tax. No need to pay for childrens education either or medical insurance. I can't buy a lot of foods that i would like back home, like nice cheese, imported beer or a tub of pringles. Those things are rare treats as every moment i am well aware of the budget i live on. If your struggling with thise then you will struggle with preparing your retirement, and that's why chichi is and others like myself are thinking of returning. When you take into these accounts would you gamble on your retirement in the same situation?
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:34 pm

SilverbackPeru wrote:You could have a boom bust situation at any point in latin america where you could lose everything you've worked your entire life for and this are what some of the stories are that you hear off in-laws.


At the moment, there's stability in Peru and the economy goes reasonable well but in 2016 there will be new elections. What's the new president going to do? It might be possible that the country goes backwards again.
Which has happened in the past.

SilverbackPeru wrote:Just from reading the article chichi posted on a house for £1.70 nwhere it stated the couple were paying £450 for rent with bills included, which for anything past the watford gap was a pretty decent comparision for bills and rent for low quality life in the UK, you would still have if a single person on minimum wage of £990 ($1700) a month be left with £540 ($900). How many people in Lima get $1700 a month or even $900 at that! Everyting is almost the same price too once you've taken out rent and electric and council tax. No need to pay for childrens education either or medical insurance. I can't buy a lot of foods that i would like back home, like nice cheese, imported beer or a tub of pringles. Those things are rare treats as every moment i am well aware of the budget i live on. If your struggling with thise then you will struggle with preparing your retirement, and that's why chichi is and others like myself are thinking of returning. When you take into these accounts would you gamble on your retirement in the same situation?


There's no social security in Peru. You lose your job, you get no help from the goverment. You get sick, you get no help from the government. If you want to attend a training, no money = no training. And on top of that the quality of education is low.

Also costs have gone up a lot in the last few years.

Like in my previous posts from 5 years ago that Adrian posted here again, I was thinking of staying in Peru back then. 5 years ago, I rented a flat for $200 a month but the same flat now rents out for $350.
I am lucky that I have own my home but if I didn't, I probably have allready left by now.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:47 pm

Would you also take a pension with a Peruvian bank and their insane interest rates? Not a chance! Or trust them or any governement with saving? No! Which narrows downs ways of how you prepare your retirement. Property like everywhere could devalue but it could become next to nothung if there's ever a case of hyper inflation again! And that's the problem, there is no real security here the rug can be pulled from under your feet at any moment.

Lets face it your taxes are just going to line the pocket of the next corrupt greedy minister or president, and the same with all those nice big fat bank charges you end up paying as well.
Last edited by SilverbackPeru on Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:51 pm

SilverbackPeru wrote:Would you also take a pension with a Peruvian bank and their insane interest rates? Not a chance! Or trust them or any governement with saving? No!


Which interest rates?
The charge a monthy maintenance fee on your account and for every transaction you have to pay.
Even if you want to check your balance at an ATM, you pay 1 sol for that.

But interest rates in Europe are lousy as well. I get 0.75% on my savings account. I prefer that they don't pay interest at all because 0.75% is just an insult.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:54 pm

But compared to Peru tho, interest rates for loans are a joke here.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby teamoperu » Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:08 pm

adrian Thorne wrote:I Quote:

400 dollars a month for two people
by euroman » Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:00 pm
GUYS,

WE PAY 200 DOLLARS A MONTH FOR MY 2 BED RENTAL FLAT
WE SPEND ABOUT 150 A MONTH ON GROCERIES
AND WE PAY ABOUT 20 DOLLARS A MONTH FOR WATER AND ELECTRICITY
WE SPEND 15 DOLLARS A MONTH ON TRANSPORT

WE ARE NOT RICH BUT HAPPY. I NEVER GOING BACK TO EUROPE
I AM WORKING 20 HOURS A WEEK. I COULDN´T SEE MYSELF WORKING 50 HOURS A WEEK LIKE AND IDIOT IN EUROPE JUST TO MAKE ENDS MEET.

VIVA LA PERU


WHEREVER YOU ARE FROM
by euroman » Fri Oct 16, 2009 2:12 pm
Guys,
wherever part of the world you are from. Are you intending to stay in Peru or ever going back to your country.

I am staying here. I have my own (very small) business.
I dont make a lot of money but just enough to live but I am happy here.
In Europe, I had a lot of stress and just working to pay the bills.
I also think that it would be too difficult for my wife to live in Europe


Too funny! LOL
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby mammamia » Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:45 pm

In my humble opinion all those who posted in this thread are right in their own ways:

- Peru isn't a paradise for the people who believe that the state should play a bigger part in the welfare of its citizens and even foreigners giving away benefits and money on different social projects;
- Peru isn't a good place to stay for families with little kids with a monthly income of $1000-2000;
- Peru is quite good though for retirees who keep their money in foreign banks and spend it in this country;
- Peru is a great place for foreign workers who work for NGO's and embassies;

All of these are correct but let's not forget that there's a story behind each person. Let's not forget either that the expat community living in Peru isn't made up only of comparatively well-to-do Americans and Western Europeans who can any time choose to come back to their native countries and live comparatively well there, there're also thousands of immigrants from other "not so well-to-do" places like Cuba, India, Bangladesh, Pakistan, China and even some countries in Eastern Europe. For most of them there isn't an option of returning to their home countries, most of them don't ask for government handouts, - they just work hard and live much happier in Peru than back home! And Peru for many of them is a nice place to live and raise their children.

Everything is relative!!!
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Mon Jul 28, 2014 2:14 pm

mammamia wrote:- Peru is a great place for foreign workers who work for NGO's and embassies;


Any country is great for them because they get free accomodation, transport and a good wage. And many of them don't have to work a lot.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby SilverbackPeru » Mon Jul 28, 2014 4:26 pm

mammamia wrote:In my humble opinion all those who posted in this thread are right in their own ways:

- Peru isn't a paradise for the people who believe that the state should play a bigger part in the welfare of its citizens and even foreigners giving away benefits and money on different social projects;
- Peru isn't a good place to stay for families with little kids with a monthly income of $1000-2000;
- Peru is quite good though for retirees who keep their money in foreign banks and spend it in this country;
- Peru is a great place for foreign workers who work for NGO's and embassies;

All of these are correct but let's not forget that there's a story behind each person. Let's not forget either that the expat community living in Peru isn't made up only of comparatively well-to-do Americans and Western Europeans who can any time choose to come back to their native countries and live comparatively well there, there're also thousands of immigrants from other "not so well-to-do" places like Cuba, India, Bangladesh, Pakistan, China and even some countries in Eastern Europe. For most of them there isn't an option of returning to their home countries, most of them don't ask for government handouts, - they just work hard and live much happier in Peru than back home! And Peru for many of them is a nice place to live and raise their children.

Everything is relative!!!


Mammamia is more than right and is talking sense. It's a case of the glass being half empty or half full depending on your own situation. I hope that if chichi is fit to work that he won't be going back just to claim benefits which will be wrong, but the benefits are there for you to work, pay your taxes and get security in hard times. There's few governments in the world that offer this in return and whom usually have the same tax rate of 30%

The system also helps people improve with reduced education fees and to get out of poverty. It looks like the member in my family who was seriously sick is on the way to recovery, but i still haven't heard from others from countries without these benefits explain how they would pay for 30 years of hospitalization for a family member? Even with health insurance there's the small print as if a human life was just likencar insurance and a team to figure out how to get out of it without paying. That is the point of the system, not for scrougers but to provide a net to catch you on hard times which is a security only a handfull of countries in the world offer. It's a security that Peru could never offer and doesn't offer for a large percent of the popullation who slave away for the equivalent of peanuts.
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby chi chi » Mon Jul 28, 2014 11:18 pm

Like the economy is going, the gap between rich and poor will become bigger and bigger and the middle class will disappear
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Re: Anyone thinking of leaving Peru.

Postby Grande Gringo » Sun Aug 10, 2014 5:26 am

Interesting to read different peoples thoughts. The general consensus seems to be;

If you are living on the Peru wage scale, it's a tough life, especially if you are paying for school kids. If you have a pension or investments from Europe/N. America, you can have a quality lifestyle in Peru.

I'm heading to work in Arequipa for 18 months for a US company so keeping my US based income. Afterward, I'll be eligible for early retirement and with my pension and investments would have about $4500-5000 usd to live on until old enough for ss. So would that afford my wife and I a decent lifestyle in Lima? What other area of Peru might be good for retirement?

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