Sergio Bernales wrote:By the way, the minimum wage in Peru is 750 soles a month, or around $290. Average income per capita at PPP in Peru is $10,000 (just under $6,000 at real exchange rates) Porters earn about $400 a month, supermarket staff about $300, plus benefits such as healthcare and holidays. Nannies and maids earn between $2,000-4,000, often with meals and accomodation includes. Waiting staff in restaurants have wide variations in pay and in many of the smaller restaurants, they are family members working together.
Lloyd007 wrote:Hold on. This can't be right.
Nanny's and maids earn between $2000-4000 a month?!?!?
Are they looking after 20 kids at a time and cleaning a 20 bedroom palace everyday?
Philipc4u59 wrote:I can remember when I was 12 & working as a bus boy in a friends restaurant in the US.
I received far below the minimum wage (as I was underage - but classified as "family"); I would always make sure the tables were impecably clean - as the watresses were busy & they didn't take the extra time.
The restaurant had its REGULARS, that noticed my work ethic & would give me a 25 cent tip; in addition to the 15% for the waitress. I saved my money (including tips) until 16 & bought an old car. I was the only person of modest income to have MY OWN WHEELS in high school; it was a "slider" (rusted) - but MINE!
At Christmas time, I was in a very small restaurant in a bad section of Barranco (got lost trying to visit my wife at work). I had a wonderful fish meal (including soup) for 7 soles; I gave the delightful woman 10 soles & told her it was OK - I didn't want any change (3 soles).
Her face was GLOWING & she kept saying "Feliz Navidad, etc." in a loud voice; as I was leaving, a person explained to me that the extra 3 soles was enough to buy a nice toy for her young son. I am a firm believer that God has blessed me as an American & it PLEASES HIM that I bring JOY to others; hopefully my GOOD HEART will be contageous.
The small deeds of one person, can truly "make a difference"...
PS - I also give to charities, but have been informed much of the money is not allocated properly
Josh2U wrote:That is a harsh unfair judgement on the porter. Why should she care what he spends his gift on anyway? It would be the porters gift after all.
If you do not want to pay an outrageous fare then don't pay it. But don't blame someone who was generous on you being asked to pay more than the going rate. Whatever that is. Could be any number of reason why he quoted what you felt an outrageous fair. In a system where the driver and the passeger decide, there is no going rate, it is whatever the two agree on. If there is such a thing as a going rate why do we have to negotiate a fare before taking off?
Because other gringos have paid more. And generous is not the right word to use when tipping taxi drivers. The taxi drivers don't see it that way. They don't think, what a piece of luck, what a nice man. They think foreigners have too much money and will pay above the going rate.
Lloyd007 wrote:Because other gringos have paid more. And generous is not the right word to use when tipping taxi drivers. The taxi drivers don't see it that way. They don't think, what a piece of luck, what a nice man. They think foreigners have too much money and will pay above the going rate.
Other gringos have paid more because they were unaware of what the rate should be. As for the final part of your comment Sergio, you are absolutely right. People never think, ''oh, what a nice man and thank you for the tip''. The twisted minds think that you have money to burn and therefore so does everyone else from other countries. It is very sad, but it is perhaps true.
Sergio Bernales wrote:What's worse is the amount of taxis drivers who kerb crawl gringos is ridiculous. Not only are they holding up the traffic, but if you actually ask them the fare, it's usually double the going rate just because I'm a gringo. Why? Because other gringos have paid more. And generous is not the right word to use when tipping taxi drivers. The taxi drivers don't see it that way. They don't think, what a piece of luck, what a nice man. They think foreigners have too much money and will pay above the going rate.
Philipc4u59 wrote:To set the record "straight"; the 3 soles I tipped for a meal was for EXCELLENT SERVICE & A SINCERE SMILE!
I understood that the waitress needed these few extra soles; to add to HER OWN & get a Christmas present.
This was Dec. 24 & she probably already knew what to expect in wages; 3 soles was probably 1-2 hours work but made her wishes a REALITY. What a small amount to witness such JOY!!!
As for tipping taci drivers; I tip if the driver ends up in construction or anything that wasn't forseen; if they are idiling in traffic - they aren't making any money, plus using valuable fuel. Also I tip if I have antigues that I am bringing back to the showroom; they take the time to be careful & place in the trunk delicately.
I am all for "teaching a person to fish"; but have no remorse for showing a bit of EMPATHY for people who work for very low wages & have families to support. Be thankful as EXPATS; we have been BLESSED with a life-style that some Peruvians can only dream about...
bobg wrote:SERGIO YOU MAKE SOME GOOD POINTS AND NOT SO GOOD POINTS, HAVE YOU TRIED TO GET THE BOOKS OPENED AT ANY CHARITY ? GOOD LUCK WITH THAT ! YOU HAVE YOUR MOTIVE FOR GIVING GIFTS, AND SIZE OF TIPS, AND YOU SHOULDN'T IMPOSE YOURS BECAUSE ITS THE CULTURE, IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU GOT EVERYTHING BACKWARD.
GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ,,,,,,,,,,, AND LET PEOPLE DO WHAT THEY WANT, GIFTS ARE GIFTS , TAKE IT AS A GIFT THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE OUT THERE UNLIKE SOME OTHERS THAT HAVE ,AND CAN DO GIFTS AND TIPS, WHAT KIND OF WORK DO YOU DO?
tomasb wrote:Part of the US culture is to tip. The reasons are diverse but many Americans have found themselves at one point or another on the opposite side of the table. For me, I was a caddy as a teenager and made nice tips that helped me through college. During one summer, I recall that I made more money from tips than my first year teaching high school.
Since so many Americans work their way through college with waiter, bartender and other tip oriented jobs, we as a cultural entity take tipping as a natural way of giving back. I think Sergio does not understand that concept as it pertains to the US.
I may be generalizing about Peru, but the upper and middle class younger people I have met here never have worked in these service capacities like taxi drivers, doorman, waiters etc. It is considered lower class work and beneath them so they do not learn the value to their society by tipping through giving or receiving. It ultimately can raise everyone up a notch in the socio-economic classes.
As far as non-profits are concerned, many of them in Peru are scams designed to benefit the founder and giving lip service to the supposed beneficiaires. This can also be true in the US. Contributions end up paying for people's salaries, some of which are quite high. It is a racket of the highest order.
bobg wrote:WHAT DO YOU DO FOR A LIVING ? ARE YOU AN EDUCATOR ?
i APOLOGIZE FOR COMMENT, i BELIEVE ANYTHING YOU CAN DO WILL HELP IT JUST SOUNDS LIKE YOU ARE STUCK ON THE OLD WAYS CHANGE COMES ..........
Josh2U wrote:I don't mean to pry and I don't really expect an answer. It may be none of my business.
You make a living, buy food clothes and housing, by volunteering studying and writing a paper?
tomasb wrote:Part of the US culture is to tip.
tomasb wrote:Part of the US culture is to tip.
chi chi wrote:tomasb wrote:Part of the US culture is to tip.
In Europe, waiters get a fixed pay. Mostly similar to kitchen staff. But tips cause often a grudge between kitchen staff and waiters as only waiters get tips. However in some restaurants I worked in, tips get equally shared amongst cooks, waiters and dishwashers.
falconagain wrote:Personally as a Peruvian I prefer to tip, whether I am in the US or in Peru.
People will always make strange assumptions about foreigners no matter what
you do. If they never traveled the assumptions would be more outrageous.
Myths like "all gringos are rich", "gringos are not very sharp", "the United States
is responsible for the widespread poverty in the world". No matter what I do,
the stupidity of some people gets straight to the bone. Its genetic, no matter
the color of your skin.
Better to tip if you feel that is fair for you and the other. Then if people start
gossiping about you or other foreigners, it is not your concern. They will do it
richorozco wrote:I don't know if that's the best analogy because the US system is based on capitalism and free market. When you sell a home or car, you ask for top dollar based on what you think your home is worth (after looking at MLS listings, Zillow, etc...). Similarly, for a car one would look at a NADA or Kelly Blue Book for prices.
It's up to the purchaser to find out what the going rate is....and go from there.
Think about auctions, garage sales, stock market, home sales, car sales, etc....
You tip someone based on the service you receive....If the person goes out of his or her way to do something and you feel good, yes you should tip ... although I do understand that tipping 20% in Peru may "train" the Peruvian workers to bad behavior.
As for cars that operate on natural gas, the conversion kits go for $1200 so you have to take into account return on investment and using natural gas ruins yours cylinder heads and engine (the MFG did not design all the components of the engine to work on natural gas). So now, as a business man (yes ... the taxi guy is running his business) you have to take depreciation in to account as well.
In a free market, and especially where there are tourists, it is up to the client to know or become aware of going rates and then pay accordingly. There are tourist traps every where in the world... 3rd world countries included.
If you really want to make change... petition the government to enforce the use of meters. Even cities in Mexico use a meter system. Of course, you have to audit the companies, calibrate the meters, etc....
Josh2U wrote:You take it off topic raise some points that need addressing. Some back and forth goes on. You raise yet some other points that need addressing but before any one can you want to close your off topic. OK message understood. Back to the topic.
Sergio Bernales wrote:what's the best way to help improve the quality of life for low-paid Peruvians?
chi chi wrote:Sergio Bernales wrote:what's the best way to help improve the quality of life for low-paid Peruvians?
It's simple. Tackling government corruption where a lot of the tax income ends up in politicians their pockets and tax the rich and the business a high income tax.
That money can be used to build social housing units, free education and healthcare. And pay wellfare benefits to the unemployed and the ones that can't work due to sickness or the handicapped people.
And pay people a pension they can live off without having to sell caramelos on the street to supplement their lousy pension.
Seaimpin_Na_nDaoine wrote:wages for bar staff and waiting staff in the UK are considerable lower than Dublin so the tips were needed more where as back home it was just a little bonus hardly worth getting excited about.