RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

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Soudie
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RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby Soudie » Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:13 pm

Hola.

I'm a U.S. citizen with Peruvian residency (through marriage). I was granted my carné de extranjería in October of 2015. I returned to the U.S. last month and originally planned to stay for only three months. Plans have changed, so I now want to know PRECISELY how long I can remain in the U.S. on this trip without losing my residency (because I would rather eat a full donkey head and a BIG bucket full of raw mystery meat from Cusco's San Pedro market than go through the process of obtaining my C.E. again). I emailed Migraciones last month, and this was their response:

Estimado(a) Usuario(a):

De acuerdo su consulta permítame informarle que conforme a lo establecido en el artículo 42° del Decreto Legislativo 1043 que modifica la Ley de Extranjería aprobado por el Decreto Legislativo 703º nos indica que se da la PÉRDIDA DE LA CONDICIÓN MIGRATORIA (Calidades migratorias de Trabajador, Familiar Residente, Estudiante, Rentista, Religioso, Profesional e Inversionista), se da si la ausencia del país de cualquiera de las categorías antes mencionadas, excediera de Ciento ochenta y tres (183) días calendarios consecutivos o acumulados durante un periodo cualquiera de (12) meses, salvo por razones de fuerza mayor, laborales o de salud debidamente comprobadas, en cuyo caso la ausencia puede extender hasta doce (12) meses, previa presentación de una solicitud dirigida a MIGRACIONES, requiriendo Autorización de Ausencia por más de 183 días.

Por lo tanto si el ciudadano extranjero ha estado fuera del país más de 183 días, entonces a su posterior ingreso al país será considerado como “Turista”, por lo que deberá volver a solicitar la residencia.

Agradecemos de antemano por su consulta.
Saludos cordiales.
Atentamente,

SUPERINTENDENCIA NACIONAL DE MIGRACIONES


For all you residents, you probably know by now how ambiguous rules in Peru can be, so even after this response, I'm still not confident that I understand what they mean. A friend even went to Migraciones (in Cusco) today to ask for clarification, and their response was basically the same as above.

How do I count the 183 days?
- Do I look at ANY 12 month period? e.g, October 2015 to October 2016, November 2015 to November 2016, December 2015 to December 2016, etc. And if I have NOT exceeded 183 days -- whether consecutive or accumulated/accumulative(?) -- in any of those periods, I'm safe, right?

- OR is it by calendar year? January to December?

- OR is it based on when a C.E. expires? In my case, October (I already renewed it in August), so -- October to October?

I was in the U.S. from November 20, 2015 to January 10, 2016, so it is especially confusing for me. I just don't know where to start counting. I'd like to come as close to maxing out my days as possible (leaving a 7-day cushion). For this trip, I arrived on September 10 and would Iike to return to Cusco sometime in February.

I'm not just concerned about having to re-do the 300 steps it took to obtain residency, but I now finally have comprehensive medical insurance in Peru through EsSalud, and I don't want to jeopardize that; I can't afford any lapse in my coverage.

Any clarification would be appreciated! (With details and/or an example, even more so!)

Thanks.


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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby MarcoPE » Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:34 pm

Maybe I'm wrong but I think you can't be out of Peru for more than 6 months when you have a CV. It seems to be 183 days consecutive.
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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby Soudie » Thu Oct 27, 2016 12:03 am

Thanks for your response, MarcoPE, but I have no intention of being out of Peru for more than 183 days (6 months). Sorry if I wasn't clear on that. I just want to know how Migraciones counts those 183 days -- from which date to which date they will be counting.
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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby cariboso » Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:01 am

My understanding is that it is 183 days accumulated in the 12 month period which your CE is active.
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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby Soudie » Thu Oct 27, 2016 9:18 am

Thank you. I already understood that the limit to be out of Peru for a resident is 183 days consecutive OR accumulated. My C.E. is current/active and shouldn't expire until October 2017.

What I'm hoping someone will make CRYSTAL CLEAR to me is the period in which Migraciones determines:
"Ciento ochenta y tres (183) días calendarios consecutivos o acumulados durante un periodo cualquiera de (12) meses"

The thing is -- it doesn't matter what I believe that to mean; what matters is what Migraciones believes that to mean. So, again, I'm just looking for clarification from someone who knows for certain. Preferably based on experience. Guesses don't really help.

From my understanding, once residency is granted (which it was, over one year ago), that would be ANY block of 12 months. i.e., Sept-Sept, Oct-Oct, Dec-Dec, Jan-Jan, etc. Imagine a 12" ruler with each inch representing a month (or 30 day period, +/- a day). Move that ruler forward anywhere on a calendar. Do they count ONLY what falls within the ruler (the 12-month period) and disregard any travel that occurred prior? That could be October 27, 2015 to October 27, 2016, for example. So, from that point, any travel on or before October 26, 2015 is no longer counted. Is that correct? I really don't know how else to illustrate this.

The quote highlighted above was Migraciones' official cut & paste response. The literal translation in English, I know. Now I just want it spelled out so there is no possibility of misinterpretation. Thanks.
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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby jumpinjack » Thu Oct 27, 2016 10:08 am

"Ciento ochenta y tres (183) días calendarios consecutivos o acumulados durante un periodo cualquiera de (12) meses"
Don't see how it could be much more crystallized.
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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby fanning » Thu Oct 27, 2016 1:19 pm

Reading the reply of Migraciones I would interpreted it as on the moment you return to Peru, Migraciones will at that moment look if the previous 12 months you were at least 6 months in Peru, else they will enter you as a tourist.
Because that is the moment that the official will actually look at your CE and your passport and make the determination to let you enter as a resident or as a tourist.
He cannot look into the future, by assuming you will remain in the future in Peru.. You might leave Peru again the very next day ( kind of an inverse border hop.. )
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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby Soudie » Thu Oct 27, 2016 1:56 pm

fanning, thank you for that different perspective; it was helpful and makes sense. It didn't even occur to me to look at it in that way, duh.

Having undergone various tramites in Peru over the past 20 months -- for marriage, residency, business, and education -- I've learned that it's far better to appear foolish by asking seemingly dumb questions than potentially waste a lot of time and money over a misunderstanding.
amigorick

Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby amigorick » Wed Nov 16, 2016 4:16 pm

My lawyer has informed me that permenant residents such as Rentistas are now allowed to spend a maximum of 365 consecutive days outside of Peru to keep their residency. This is published in NORMAS LEGALES in "El Peruano" dated September 26, 2015 and they have forwarded me a copy of the associated page. I asked about how the Migraciones website still references the 6 month limit but he assured me that the 365 day maximum is correct and the website is out of date. is anyone else aware of this?
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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby jhand8pp4 » Wed Nov 16, 2016 8:39 pm

I hope that I am wrong but I understand that Rentista Visas are now classified as temporary visas and not permanent resident visas. I think most of us are anxiously awaiting the regulations to be published on the law that you cited. Also, it may be that those who held a Rentista Visa when the law was passed may be grandfathered in with the same privileges they held before the law was passed. Who knows? If you find out either way, please let us know.
amigorick

Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby amigorick » Sat Nov 19, 2016 11:01 am

Soudie,

Can you please provide the web address where you submitted your inquiry with Migraciones?

Thanks!
Soudie
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Re: RESIDENTS w/ C.E. -- I need help understanding 183-day limit for travel outside Peru

Postby Soudie » Sat Nov 19, 2016 3:52 pm

amigorick,

Head over to the Migraciones website: https://www.migraciones.gob.pe/
I remember filling out a contact form, and the only one I see on the site is the Buzón de Sugerencias: https://www.migraciones.gob.pe/index.ph ... gerencias/ (both CONTACTO and ATENCIÓN al USUARIO will lead you there). I just searched the site somewhat thoroughly, and I can't find any other form, so I suppose that's where I submitted my inquiry (even though it was neither queja nor sugerencia). Must say, I was pleasantly surprised to have received a response within a few hours (on a weekday).

If that doesn't work for you, the response came from: [email protected]

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